Heeellp - Ketosis question :( *cross posted*

Discussion in 'SlimFast' started by Ela ine, 24 May 2011 Social URL.

  1. Ela ine

    Ela ine Likes to post, and eat.

    Posts:
    3,207
    Likes Received:
    26
    Start Weight:
    18st11lb
    Current Weight:
    16st7lb
    Goal Weight:
    12st0lb
    Lost(%):
    2st4lb(12.17%)
    Diet:
    Dukan
    I am so annoyed/upset/confused

    Decided to have ‘a meal’ for lunch today instead of dinner (since I have Brownies and won’t be home ‘till late) went to the kitchen to prepare Jacket potatoe, salad and beans (always have foods ready – just in case)

    While in the kitchen someone else from the office (not my department) was preparing a lighter life soup… then started giving me the whole ‘I thought you were doing slim fast’ talk. Explained that you can have one meal a day etc.. not that I should be defending myself (I thought I got sf :S)

    It turns out I am ‘not in ketosis’ and I won’t be on slim fast unless I cut carbs completely.

    Man. I’m SO confused right now. No wonder I have only been loosing a pound a week. URGH!

    Can anyone explain ketosis to me?

    I don’t know what to do L The reason I switched to slim fast, was because after losing 2 stone on slimming world (really slowly) I felt like I needed a change.
    I just feel so confused right now. I can’t afford to do a diet like lighter life.

    Eeeeeeek. Help help. Please help.
     
  2. Avatar

    MiniMins.com Matched Content

  3. Wishbird007

    Wishbird007 Gold Member

    Posts:
    3,851
    Likes Received:
    4
    Start Weight:
    12st0lb
    Current Weight:
    12st0lb
    Goal Weight:
    10st7lb
    Lost(%):
    0st0lb(0%)
    Diet:
    Slimming world/Low calorie dieting
    Ignore them! they being stupid!
    X
    Do a search for a link called today's the day on here there's an explanation re ketosis on there hun x I dont quite understand it x
     
  4. Wishbird007

    Wishbird007 Gold Member

    Posts:
    3,851
    Likes Received:
    4
    Start Weight:
    12st0lb
    Current Weight:
    12st0lb
    Goal Weight:
    10st7lb
    Lost(%):
    0st0lb(0%)
    Diet:
    Slimming world/Low calorie dieting
    I have found the quote -

    This isn't sustainable. There are too many carbs in slimfast to use as a VLCD therefore you won't go into ketosis. You will therefore be starving your body. If you want a diet like that try one of the many VLCD. If not use slimfast with food. The weight does come off. With a VLCD you can not vary at all not a morsel of food. With slimfast if you go out for lunch or cant get a shake you can juggle things around to keep in your calories.
     
  5. Starlight

    Starlight Gold Member

    Posts:
    37,910
    Likes Received:
    1,128
    Diet:
    Weight Watchers
    You can do a higher programme on the VLCDs which allows you a 400 cal low carb high protein meal and keeps you in ketosis. The losses aren't as high as with TFR

    Thanks for that post re ketosis and SF wishbird I think I'll bookmark that. I've seen the ketosis question asked before on here :)
     
    Last edited: 24 May 2011
  6. Wishbird007

    Wishbird007 Gold Member

    Posts:
    3,851
    Likes Received:
    4
    Start Weight:
    12st0lb
    Current Weight:
    12st0lb
    Goal Weight:
    10st7lb
    Lost(%):
    0st0lb(0%)
    Diet:
    Slimming world/Low calorie dieting
    No prob lovey xx
     
  7. Ela ine

    Ela ine Likes to post, and eat.

    Posts:
    3,207
    Likes Received:
    26
    Start Weight:
    18st11lb
    Current Weight:
    16st7lb
    Goal Weight:
    12st0lb
    Lost(%):
    2st4lb(12.17%)
    Diet:
    Dukan
    Thanks Starlight! - yeah it was me who asked/cross posting!

    WB - thanks for the link!
    I think I understand now.. the impression I got earlier at lunch time was that

    no ketosis = no weight loss.
    But now I understand that no carbs = ketosis = burning more.

    Well, hopefully I understand this.

    In the case of VLC diet's do they also work by restricting carbs, as well as calories? hence sf couldn't put you in ketosis because of the carb content.

    (phew! I thought getting to grips with red days/green days was difficult :rolleyes:)

    SF works by cutting cals.. in the same way as slimming world/weight watchers etc?
    But not significantly enough for very fast weight loss. Is this right? Sorry if I sound like I'm going round in circles/going on.

    I really appreciate the support and advice I get on here :eek:
     
  8. awcarly

    awcarly Loves to lose

    Posts:
    225
    Likes Received:
    2
    Start Weight:
    14st10lb
    Current Weight:
    14st5lb
    Goal Weight:
    10st7lb
    Lost(%):
    0st5lb(2.43%)
    Diet:
    Slim fast
    ketosis happens when your body is starved of starches and sugars, it just burns fat cells rather than fat from an external source (food) of course you will lose weight if you are eating under your basal metabolic rate but if you put yourself into ketosis you will lose it quicker, however, the danger with very low calorie diets is that your body will tend to hold on to fat when proper food returns.
     
  9. awcarly

    awcarly Loves to lose

    Posts:
    225
    Likes Received:
    2
    Start Weight:
    14st10lb
    Current Weight:
    14st5lb
    Goal Weight:
    10st7lb
    Lost(%):
    0st5lb(2.43%)
    Diet:
    Slim fast
    Calories are just a measure of energy.. they are measured by how many carbs, fats and proteins are in food. You need carbs to help your body function, starving yourself of them and inducing ketosis means that your body has no external energy source and basically eats itself, that's why vlcd are bad for you if they are prolonged.. they also cause your body to hold on to what fat you have once food is re-introduced. However, if you are still eating a good amount of carbs but are under your basal rate you WILL lose weight, the heavier you are, the quicker it should come off in theory.

    It's best to chose food/snacks that are high in carbs for their mass but low in calories i.e fruit and veg (as they fill you up longer) if you stick to sugary snacks your body might hold on to the excess glucose created by sugary/high carb content.
    Usually people go on very low carb diets because they do not want the excess energy if they aren't burning it off (by exercising) but even if you cut out bread, potatoes etc which are dense in carbs, there are still a lot of carbs in fruit/veg by mass and if you are on a vlcd of soups/shakes only you are effectively starving your body of these carbs = ketosis and prolonged exposure of it is really bad for you.

    You might not be losing weight effectively because you wait too long between eating and it's throwing your metabolism off. If followed at optimum you should lose weight effectively on slim fast (check the name lol) you should be eating toughly every two hours if you are eating roughly 200cals at every sitting because your body will run out of energy and you will start to feel hungry/irritable and your body might try to hold on to the glucose proving weight loss to be slower each day...that's what is meant when people say "you aren't eating enough" . You will lose a lot of weight by eating little because starvation of calories (formed by protein, carbs and sugars) is what actually induces ketosis in the first place. Ketosis can be set off by eating too little calories as calories are just a formula for energy and you get your energy in foods from carbs and sugars.


    As a point, my boyfriend lost 11lbs this week eating carbs but very low carlories (roughly 800cals a day which is really under his basal metabollic rate) because his body went into ketosis, even though he was eating high carb foods, the calorie content was low.
     
  10. Starlight

    Starlight Gold Member

    Posts:
    37,910
    Likes Received:
    1,128
    Diet:
    Weight Watchers
    SF does indeed work the same as WW/SW as it reduces calories but no to the level of a VLCD. With a VLCD youll lose around a stone a month, on one of the higher plans (which allows a meal) youll lose around 10lbs a month.

    If youre doing WW/SW etc the losses are around 7lbs a week, I believe SF is round about that.

    It really depends what you want to do. If youre coping with 3 shakes plus a meal then you could most definitely do SS+ on Cambridge or Working Solutions on Exante
     
  11. awcarly

    awcarly Loves to lose

    Posts:
    225
    Likes Received:
    2
    Start Weight:
    14st10lb
    Current Weight:
    14st5lb
    Goal Weight:
    10st7lb
    Lost(%):
    0st5lb(2.43%)
    Diet:
    Slim fast
    hun, I would rather have a lovely meal in the evening and get to experience food and still lose weight at a decent rate than lose it quickly and be miserable for the mean time. if you are struggling with slim fast send me a pm, i have been eating slighly different to everyone else but I have not been hungry because of it and i've lost 5lbs xx
     
  12. Starlight

    Starlight Gold Member

    Posts:
    37,910
    Likes Received:
    1,128
    Diet:
    Weight Watchers
    How did he know he was in ketosis though, people on CD who are on 400 cals dont go into ketosis if they have carbs etc The calorie intake on a VLCD is lower than 800kcals and thats no guarantee of getting into ketosis. People have been knocked out of ketosis by having one small amount of carbs

    Is his loss not more likely to be down to the massive calorie deficit he had. Ive just never ever heard of anyone going into ketosis by eating carbs. Carbs are the one thing guaranteed to knock you out of ketosis and I cant undeerstand how anyone can get into it by eating carbs :confused: Sounds more like his body went into starvation :(

    From an online site Ketosis is the state that your body enters into when it starts converting stored fat into ketones to use as fuel for your cells. If you eat plenty of carbohydrates, you will never enter into ketosis. Instead, your body will simply use all that glucose as a fuel.

    Hope hes not planning on making a habit of that though :(
     
    Last edited: 24 May 2011
  13. Starlight

    Starlight Gold Member

    Posts:
    37,910
    Likes Received:
    1,128
    Diet:
    Weight Watchers
    Being on a VLCD doesnt mean youre miserable the whole time - honest ;)
     
  14. awcarly

    awcarly Loves to lose

    Posts:
    225
    Likes Received:
    2
    Start Weight:
    14st10lb
    Current Weight:
    14st5lb
    Goal Weight:
    10st7lb
    Lost(%):
    0st5lb(2.43%)
    Diet:
    Slim fast
    The reason they get "knocked off" is because they have gone from no carbs to some and the body clings onto it and doesn't need to effectively eat itself for sustainability anymore because an external form of energy has been introduced.From what I have read, ketosis can also be induced by having too low calories because calories are a unit of energy, carbs/sugars are also energy. If you are having too little energy of either kind, your body begins using up lipocytes (fat cells) instead of using the glucose in food to burn. That is why he had such a massive weight loss, it is not just down to carbs/sugars, it's just that these components in food are how we obtain energy and too much energy without being burnt off means excess fat so the logical thing is to severely cut down carbs/sugars.

    It's why I also don't understand why people say you don't lose weight effectively if you aren't eating enough because your body goes into starvation mode but ketosis is induced by starvation of energy either by calorie intake or reduction of carbs/sugars.
     
    Last edited: 24 May 2011
  15. Starlight

    Starlight Gold Member

    Posts:
    37,910
    Likes Received:
    1,128
    Diet:
    Weight Watchers
    I edited my post and we probably cross posted. I was really curious about this and googled and numerous places say

    Ketosis is the state that your body enters into when it starts converting stored fat into ketones to use as fuel for your cells. If you eat plenty of carbohydrates, you will never enter into ketosis. Instead, your body will simply use all that glucose as a fuel.

    People on a VLCD sarent going from no carbs to carbs, to enter ketosis you need to be under a certain amount of carbs, all the VLCD packs have carbs in them so we ARE having some carbs daily. However even a slight additionm to that is enough to knock people out, so its not a case of going from none to some. Did your boyfriend test himself for ketosis or is he just assuming cos of his weight loss

    I think we'll need to agree to disagree because absoolutely nowhere at all can I see anyone backing up your theory every single article coming up clearly says you need to be under a certain amount of carbs to get into ketosis and any over that is going to stop you getting in or kick you out.

    Congrats to your bf on his loss this week though but hope hes going to be sensible about it next week :)
     
  16. Starlight

    Starlight Gold Member

    Posts:
    37,910
    Likes Received:
    1,128
    Diet:
    Weight Watchers
    Elaine in answer to your original questions :) You need to either accept the lower losses on SF and enjoy the food youre having or go the dark side ;) and do a proper VLCD

    Best of luck whatever you decide
     
  17. possum

    possum Full Member

    Posts:
    213
    Likes Received:
    8
    Start Weight:
    18st3lb
    Current Weight:
    9st13lb
    Goal Weight:
    10st10lb
    Lost(%):
    8st4lb(45.49%)
    Diet:
    Lighter Life
    A body will not go into ketosis if there is glucose or glycogen available, it just can't/won't. If the body has enough carbohydrate available, it will use it. Always. People can be in ketosis on very high calorie diets too - for example, Atkins or people on ketogenic diets for medical reasons (people with epilepsy)

    Being on VLCD does not cause metabolic changes afterwards which changes the way bodies burn energy or stores fat in the future - unless you have found any kind of research that shows that it induces permanent Insulin Resistance. Metabolic rate does decrease on VLCD, like it does on all diets, but that's normal and metabolic rates do change all the time.
     
  18. Avatar

    MiniMins.com Advert

  19. awcarly

    awcarly Loves to lose

    Posts:
    225
    Likes Received:
    2
    Start Weight:
    14st10lb
    Current Weight:
    14st5lb
    Goal Weight:
    10st7lb
    Lost(%):
    0st5lb(2.43%)
    Diet:
    Slim fast
    I could write a heck of a lot but i'll just put it this way, I believe science speaks for itself not bias. I'm just clarifying for the op, and I have said nothing that actually contradicts what you have posted nor did I say he was eating an abundance of carbs, they refer to carbs because they are the most prolific way of receiving energy, it is just science, carbs are in everything and what I should have said was going from too little than your body needs to on or above what your body needs will throw someone out of ketosis, that is scientific fact and if you have the energy there are posts all over the internet which will show you the scientific formulae for how fat is burnt and how it affects the metabolic rate. I'm not coming back to this thread as I enjoy using this website and am not looking for an argument, best of luck to on your weight loss.
     
  20. awcarly

    awcarly Loves to lose

    Posts:
    225
    Likes Received:
    2
    Start Weight:
    14st10lb
    Current Weight:
    14st5lb
    Goal Weight:
    10st7lb
    Lost(%):
    0st5lb(2.43%)
    Diet:
    Slim fast
    Being on VLCD does not cause metabolic changes afterwards which changes the way bodies burn energy or stores fat in the future - unless you have found any kind of research that shows that it induces permanent Insulin Resistance. Metabolic rate does decrease on VLCD, like it does on all diets, but that's normal and metabolic rates do change all the time.

    Yes it does, just google prolonged ketosis and effects of starvation which is what ketosis effectively is. Anyways, I might aswell be banging my head against a brick wall, don't wish to fall out over this so I am leaving
     
  21. awcarly

    awcarly Loves to lose

    Posts:
    225
    Likes Received:
    2
    Start Weight:
    14st10lb
    Current Weight:
    14st5lb
    Goal Weight:
    10st7lb
    Lost(%):
    0st5lb(2.43%)
    Diet:
    Slim fast
    atkins isn't a high calorific diet you aren't supposed to fry things and meat is supposed to be lean.. again, agree to disagree I think, I respectfully ask you to let me leave this thread if possible lol
     
  22. Starlight

    Starlight Gold Member

    Posts:
    37,910
    Likes Received:
    1,128
    Diet:
    Weight Watchers
    Like I said we'll agree to disagree

    Personally i just dont want Elaine or someone thiniking they can eat carbs to their hearts content and still go into ketosis and lose more weight when it just isnt going to happen
     
Popular Forums
  1. MiniMins.com is a weight loss support community helping each other on their weight loss journey. We have a multitude of forums, from Slimming World and Exante, to Success Stories. Click the logo at the top right to return to the forum home page at any time.
Loading...
Similar Threads - Heeellp Ketosis question
  1. Coach Reid
    Replies:
    3
    Views:
    913
  2. Kathleenveronica
    Replies:
    28
    Views:
    1,732
  3. JustForMe
    Replies:
    1
    Views:
    357
  4. London_dancer
    Replies:
    7
    Views:
    977
  5. jindal
    Replies:
    6
    Views:
    760