Karion Rambles No. 2 Food addiction and peptides - MiniMins.com

KD · 9th August, 2007

Hi again folks!

Thought I'd do a holiday diary. Bit more time on my hands at the moment and besides, I'm bringing Tracey's diary down with my long rambling 'deep and meaningfuls'

So I thought I would do the 'deep and meaningfuls' on this thread until the school term start again anyway.

Introduction
We were discussing Addictive Desires (AD)
Look here for the first installment

http://www.minimins.com/cambridge-di...begins-13.html (New Me, New Diary! Maintenance Begins)

Okay, so things aren't quite as easy as just accepting the desire. For one thing, how do you know it's an AD, not a genuine need for food?

When I finished with Cambridge, I joined WLR so that I could find out what was 'normal' eating. I needed to know portion sizes, types of foods, balance of the food groups. That doesn't mean that I always ate a normal amount, but I could identify what was normal and what wasn't. I may look back on the days food and think

Yep...a pretty 'normal' day there or
Think I overdid it a tad there
Blimey!!! That was no where near normal!!!

But at least I gradually understood what 'normal' was.

With this knowledge, I could then work out my patterns of eating, what my body needed, and what was AD.

I did many other steps before I really identified my AD, mainly because I didn't realise that AD existed. I thought it was more to do with my body needing more because I was addicted. I was trying to stop the desire as the desire inevitably led to eating.. Some of the steps helped, some didn't. A lot of trial and error there. Always trying to balance it with Intuitive Eating, but without throwing my common sense out of the window. Guess I intuitively want to use my common sense

I did a lot of research in those days. The internet, friends, strangers. I'd 'meet' people on various forums and wouldn't exchange email address unless they answered my 100 questions on weight, what they eat, how much exercise they do, if they've ever had an eating disorder etc

I needed to seek out the 'normal' people. Find what they were doing and attempt to emulate them. I now know the eating habits of many concert pianists, webdesigners and teachers

It's taken time for me to get it all in order but once I identified my chatterbox as my AD, I found I could take one huge step forward. Possibly the answer that will keep me going for life.

I'll add more later about this later, and some general stuff about life in Karionland. Feel free to ask questions

Maintainer · 9th August, 2007

I shall bookmark this immediately and keep reading, but won't profess to understand a word (yet)...

Keep it coming Karion. You're a big inspiration to me.

MadamDotty · 9th August, 2007

Hey Karion

Good to see a KD thread again

you've certainly got me thinking and I'm about to do a ramble on my own thread.

Always fascinated to read your thoughts, you certainly give us a lot to think about and don't let us off too easily either

which speaking from my own experience is a good thing

Will be interested to see where this goes

xxx

**canireallydothis!!** · 9th August, 2007

KD, Fab, keep going, Im at work, so need to read and digest later, Ill have a marathon session.

Thanks for your thoughts, I need these at this point in my life.

BFN x

KD · 9th August, 2007

Thanks ladies

Met someone this morning that I haven't seen for ages.

She said "Wow....you've lost loads of weight

"

I said "I haven't

" She looked at me with sympathy

and insisted I had.

Wasn't until I got home that I realised I haven't seem her for about 3 years

What a loony

Will write more about AD later. Off for an appointment with a priest in a min. Boy...I certainly now how to live

**canireallydothis!!** · 9th August, 2007

Talk more about chatterbox and AD pls, this bit seems to be making sense I think ????

**canireallydothis!!** · 9th August, 2007

Planning, talk to me about planning, is it ok to have a desert after my tea, as long as I have the one, or plan how much I am going to have, as long as I just have that and leave the rest where it is, or do I just not buy anything to have??

Im stressed out a bit, I need to know what to do! Not about the desert, but about life!

KD · 9th August, 2007

Good question Vicky

Planning. Yes, I did plan. I don't plan so much now, but if the weight goes up just a tiny bit, I do.

You do need to be quite confident with what constitutes a normal portion. I know what a normal portion of cereal is. I know how much shepherds pie I need etc. I know my normal portion is about 2/3 of the rest of my family (live with men!)

So I planned. I like to eat, and prefer snacks inbetween so I plan for those too. I also like to have something sweet after dinner. Not always, but often.

I don't pick diet foods unless it's something I really want, but I try to chose healthy foods because regardless of my weight...I'm kinda fond of being healthy

I still have other things too, but I know they aren't really for my body...I just like them

I do try to distinguish between the two.

Having planned what a 'normal' person would eat, I then know that if I'm craving anything between those times, then it's probably my AD.

So for example I've had dinner and I've sat down to watch the television with a slice of cake. I finish the cake and I want more. There is no way that I am hungry, though at times my mind thinks I am...but I can't be.

I take a moment to acknowledge my AD. I think to myself "Bloomin' AD playing up again

....Ha...chance to work on this...you're not hungry, you don't need anything just yet...but it was yummy cake, so I'll make my evening snack another slice" Then I'll go back to watching the TV.

The thing is, I'm not watching the TV to distract myself. Would be doing that (during the hols anyway). I'm not trying to push the AD from my mind. I'm accepting that this is just something that I have. It doesn't mean I have to follow through, just remember that it is a desire and desire doesn't necessarily mean action.

There is nothing wrong with having the desire. I think most people have it to some extent. Yep...even the skinnies. It's just they don't act immediately. They accept that they want x, and are happy to wait until another time.

Strictly speaking, you should welcome the AD, as that gives you a chance to strengthen that new connection you are trying to make. Try not to be annoyed with it. Try not to clock watch until the next meal. Just get on with what you were doing and acknowledge the desire.

Okay...takes practice

**canireallydothis!!** · 9th August, 2007

cool, i get you, so, it means acknowledging the desire but not acting on impulse maybe??

Like I desire to have a new £200 pair of shoes, well, it aint gonna happen, so i can either save up till I get them or not buy them??

Like with food, I desire the big lump of cheesecake but Ive just had dinner or what have you so it can wait, It will taste the same at suppertime or even tomorrow, and it will still be there when I would really like it??

Its the desire to keep eating rather than the need to.

I think Im getting there, its very similar to when I started moving up CD, I left food on my plate if I was full, I said no to choc if I wasnt hungry, yet the old habits crept in and I was faced with clearing my plate again, and eating what ever was there?? I felt better when I did the first stages, and my self esteem would go when I cocked it up. Back to yoyoyoyoyoyoyo all over again.

So do we just keep chipping away at it, or is there something else that will click along the way??

Keep talking KD, if Im doing your head in then say so, but I really need to get this totally understood x

KD · 9th August, 2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by canireallydothis!!

Like I desire to have a new £200 pair of shoes, well, it aint gonna happen, so i can either save up till I get them or not buy them??

That's it. But there's more to it than that. You're probably not a shopaholic. You know that desire doesn't mean 'got to have now'. Over the years you've reinforced a connection (for whatever reason), that 'want' means 'have' when it comes to food.

Quote:

Like with food, I desire the big lump of cheesecake but Ive just had dinner or what have you so it can wait, It will taste the same at suppertime or even tomorrow, and it will still be there when I would really like it??

Exactly. This is where it is similar to IE. I do have a number of problems with how some people IE but I'll go along with that one

Quote:

I think Im getting there, its very similar to when I started moving up CD, I left food on my plate if I was full, I said no to choc if I wasnt hungry, yet the old habits crept in and I was faced with clearing my plate again, and eating what ever was there??

Slightly different. It depends if you found it easy to act like that. If you did, then you probably weren't working on the AD. You were using a substitute. Probably riding on the wave of the novelty factor...eating real food...being slim.

How hard was it to do? Probably not hard at all. But of course, once the novelty factor wore off, you still had the AD monster to deal with.

It's not a case of avoiding the foods, but rather managing to face the desire without giving in to it. As you get better at that, you'll be able to cope with it whatever else happens.

Sometimes it'll be easy to avoid food, but that is no indication of whether you have fought the demons (AD).

Imagine being on a battle ground. The enemy is hiding around the corner. You get from A - B without them seeing you.

Of course, they strike when you aren't looking. Now...if you can destroy the enemy (you can tell I have sons

), that's when you've really won the war.

So it's not a case of avoiding it. You have to face it. Face the AD and learn not to act on it. Just to accept that AD happens and means nothing more than a desire.

Mrs Pink · 9th August, 2007

Hiya
I often observe skinnies to see what they do .... the ones I have observed (!) take smaller portions than me (I eat like the proverbial Irish Navvie) eat far slower than me (keeping up the similes, I wolf it down like a Dobermann that hasn't seen food for 48 hours) and they often leave food on their plate (not me! I clear mine then eye up everyone else's, such is my abhorrence of "waste"...)

I think these are the roots of my problem ... how to overcome these habits of a lifetime?

Oh and I am intrigued by your "off to meet a priest" throwaway comment - was that to ask about his nutritional habits, or to find out the Official modern stance on Gluttony?!
cheers
mrs pink

9th August, 2007	#1 (permalink)
KD Super Moderator KD's Profile Albums KD's Photo Gallery Typing Master Champion! Join Date: 22nd July, 2006 Posts: 11,676 Rep Power: 294	Karion Rambles No. 2 Food addiction and peptides Hi again folks! Thought I'd do a holiday diary. Bit more time on my hands at the moment and besides, I'm bringing Tracey's diary down with my long rambling 'deep and meaningfuls' So I thought I would do the 'deep and meaningfuls' on this thread until the school term start again anyway. Introduction We were discussing Addictive Desires (AD) Look here for the first installment http://www.minimins.com/cambridge-di...begins-13.html (New Me, New Diary! Maintenance Begins) Okay, so things aren't quite as easy as just accepting the desire. For one thing, how do you know it's an AD, not a genuine need for food? When I finished with Cambridge, I joined WLR so that I could find out what was 'normal' eating. I needed to know portion sizes, types of foods, balance of the food groups. That doesn't mean that I always ate a normal amount, but I could identify what was normal and what wasn't. I may look back on the days food and think Yep...a pretty 'normal' day there or Think I overdid it a tad there Blimey!!! That was no where near normal!!! But at least I gradually understood what 'normal' was. With this knowledge, I could then work out my patterns of eating, what my body needed, and what was AD. I did many other steps before I really identified my AD, mainly because I didn't realise that AD existed. I thought it was more to do with my body needing more because I was addicted. I was trying to stop the desire as the desire inevitably led to eating.. Some of the steps helped, some didn't. A lot of trial and error there. Always trying to balance it with Intuitive Eating, but without throwing my common sense out of the window. Guess I intuitively want to use my common sense I did a lot of research in those days. The internet, friends, strangers. I'd 'meet' people on various forums and wouldn't exchange email address unless they answered my 100 questions on weight, what they eat, how much exercise they do, if they've ever had an eating disorder etc I needed to seek out the 'normal' people. Find what they were doing and attempt to emulate them. I now know the eating habits of many concert pianists, webdesigners and teachers It's taken time for me to get it all in order but once I identified my chatterbox as my AD, I found I could take one huge step forward. Possibly the answer that will keep me going for life. I'll add more later about this later, and some general stuff about life in Karionland. Feel free to ask questions __________________ 8 Stone gone Cambridge Diet Counsellor (Bournemouth) August Wilson, "As my spirit grew bigger, my demons got smaller." Last edited by KD : 1st September, 2007 at 09:32 AM.

9th August, 2007	#2 (permalink)
Maintainer Wannabe Healthy Eater Maintainer's Profile Albums Maintainer's Photo Gallery Join Date: 3rd October, 2006 Location: France Posts: 701 My Mood: Rep Power: 16	I shall bookmark this immediately and keep reading, but won't profess to understand a word (yet)... Keep it coming Karion. You're a big inspiration to me. __________________ Joanne Start weight: 141K (March 2002) Target weight reached: 67.5K (December 2003) Maintained until Feb 2007 when I quit smoking and regained 13K+ Now - life long stabilisation - to stay between 63K and 66K. 23/10/08: 66.8K

9th August, 2007	#3 (permalink)
MadamDotty Back again! MadamDotty's Profile Albums MadamDotty's Photo Gallery Animal Rescue Champion!Tournaments Won: 11 Join Date: 31st October, 2006 Location: Telford, Shropshire Posts: 4,713 My Mood: Rep Power: 76 Diet: Maintaining after completing the Cambridge Diet earlier this year	Hey Karion Good to see a KD thread again you've certainly got me thinking and I'm about to do a ramble on my own thread. Always fascinated to read your thoughts, you certainly give us a lot to think about and don't let us off too easily either which speaking from my own experience is a good thing Will be interested to see where this goes xxx __________________ Cambridge Diet Counsellor Please support my Driving Challenge for Marie Curie Cancer Care, you can sponsor me at: www.justgiving.com/janjackman Thanks Facebook link: http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=746262945 You don't get to choose how you're doing to die or when. You can only decide how you're going to live. Joan Baez

9th August, 2007	#4 (permalink)
canireallydothis!! Bouncing back to goal canireallydothis!!'s Profile Albums canireallydothis!!'s Photo Gallery Join Date: 22nd July, 2006 Location: Brighouse, West Yorkshire Posts: 5,504 My Mood: Rep Power: 107	KD, Fab, keep going, Im at work, so need to read and digest later, Ill have a marathon session. Thanks for your thoughts, I need these at this point in my life. BFN x __________________ My ultimate goal was to wake up slim, I lived and dreamed about it. Yesterday I woke up slim Sometimes winners are dreamers that never give up. Tomorrow I will wake up slim again Week 1 -8lbs!! Please feel free to join my tiggers club here is the link http://www.minimins.com/cambridge-di...y-restart.html

9th August, 2007	#5 (permalink)
KD Super Moderator KD's Profile Albums KD's Photo Gallery Typing Master Champion! Join Date: 22nd July, 2006 Posts: 11,676 Rep Power: 294	Thanks ladies Met someone this morning that I haven't seen for ages. She said "Wow....you've lost loads of weight" I said "I haven't" She looked at me with sympathy and insisted I had. Wasn't until I got home that I realised I haven't seem her for about 3 years What a loony Will write more about AD later. Off for an appointment with a priest in a min. Boy...I certainly now how to live __________________ 8 Stone gone Cambridge Diet Counsellor (Bournemouth) August Wilson, "As my spirit grew bigger, my demons got smaller."

9th August, 2007	#6 (permalink)
canireallydothis!! Bouncing back to goal canireallydothis!!'s Profile Albums canireallydothis!!'s Photo Gallery Join Date: 22nd July, 2006 Location: Brighouse, West Yorkshire Posts: 5,504 My Mood: Rep Power: 107	Talk more about chatterbox and AD pls, this bit seems to be making sense I think ???? __________________ My ultimate goal was to wake up slim, I lived and dreamed about it. Yesterday I woke up slim Sometimes winners are dreamers that never give up. Tomorrow I will wake up slim again Week 1 -8lbs!! Please feel free to join my tiggers club here is the link http://www.minimins.com/cambridge-di...y-restart.html

9th August, 2007	#7 (permalink)
canireallydothis!! Bouncing back to goal canireallydothis!!'s Profile Albums canireallydothis!!'s Photo Gallery Join Date: 22nd July, 2006 Location: Brighouse, West Yorkshire Posts: 5,504 My Mood: Rep Power: 107	Planning, talk to me about planning, is it ok to have a desert after my tea, as long as I have the one, or plan how much I am going to have, as long as I just have that and leave the rest where it is, or do I just not buy anything to have?? Im stressed out a bit, I need to know what to do! Not about the desert, but about life! __________________ My ultimate goal was to wake up slim, I lived and dreamed about it. Yesterday I woke up slim Sometimes winners are dreamers that never give up. Tomorrow I will wake up slim again Week 1 -8lbs!! Please feel free to join my tiggers club here is the link http://www.minimins.com/cambridge-di...y-restart.html

9th August, 2007	#8 (permalink)
KD Super Moderator KD's Profile Albums KD's Photo Gallery Typing Master Champion! Join Date: 22nd July, 2006 Posts: 11,676 Rep Power: 294	Good question Vicky Planning. Yes, I did plan. I don't plan so much now, but if the weight goes up just a tiny bit, I do. You do need to be quite confident with what constitutes a normal portion. I know what a normal portion of cereal is. I know how much shepherds pie I need etc. I know my normal portion is about 2/3 of the rest of my family (live with men!) So I planned. I like to eat, and prefer snacks inbetween so I plan for those too. I also like to have something sweet after dinner. Not always, but often. I don't pick diet foods unless it's something I really want, but I try to chose healthy foods because regardless of my weight...I'm kinda fond of being healthy I still have other things too, but I know they aren't really for my body...I just like them I do try to distinguish between the two. Having planned what a 'normal' person would eat, I then know that if I'm craving anything between those times, then it's probably my AD. So for example I've had dinner and I've sat down to watch the television with a slice of cake. I finish the cake and I want more. There is no way that I am hungry, though at times my mind thinks I am...but I can't be. I take a moment to acknowledge my AD. I think to myself "Bloomin' AD playing up again....Ha...chance to work on this...you're not hungry, you don't need anything just yet...but it was yummy cake, so I'll make my evening snack another slice" Then I'll go back to watching the TV. The thing is, I'm not watching the TV to distract myself. Would be doing that (during the hols anyway). I'm not trying to push the AD from my mind. I'm accepting that this is just something that I have. It doesn't mean I have to follow through, just remember that it is a desire and desire doesn't necessarily mean action. There is nothing wrong with having the desire. I think most people have it to some extent. Yep...even the skinnies. It's just they don't act immediately. They accept that they want x, and are happy to wait until another time. Strictly speaking, you should welcome the AD, as that gives you a chance to strengthen that new connection you are trying to make. Try not to be annoyed with it. Try not to clock watch until the next meal. Just get on with what you were doing and acknowledge the desire. Okay...takes practice __________________ 8 Stone gone Cambridge Diet Counsellor (Bournemouth) August Wilson, "As my spirit grew bigger, my demons got smaller." Last edited by KD : 1st September, 2007 at 09:32 AM.

9th August, 2007	#9 (permalink)
canireallydothis!! Bouncing back to goal canireallydothis!!'s Profile Albums canireallydothis!!'s Photo Gallery Join Date: 22nd July, 2006 Location: Brighouse, West Yorkshire Posts: 5,504 My Mood: Rep Power: 107	cool, i get you, so, it means acknowledging the desire but not acting on impulse maybe?? Like I desire to have a new £200 pair of shoes, well, it aint gonna happen, so i can either save up till I get them or not buy them?? Like with food, I desire the big lump of cheesecake but Ive just had dinner or what have you so it can wait, It will taste the same at suppertime or even tomorrow, and it will still be there when I would really like it?? Its the desire to keep eating rather than the need to. I think Im getting there, its very similar to when I started moving up CD, I left food on my plate if I was full, I said no to choc if I wasnt hungry, yet the old habits crept in and I was faced with clearing my plate again, and eating what ever was there?? I felt better when I did the first stages, and my self esteem would go when I cocked it up. Back to yoyoyoyoyoyoyo all over again. So do we just keep chipping away at it, or is there something else that will click along the way?? Keep talking KD, if Im doing your head in then say so, but I really need to get this totally understood x __________________ My ultimate goal was to wake up slim, I lived and dreamed about it. Yesterday I woke up slim Sometimes winners are dreamers that never give up. Tomorrow I will wake up slim again Week 1 -8lbs!! Please feel free to join my tiggers club here is the link http://www.minimins.com/cambridge-di...y-restart.html

9th August, 2007	#11 (permalink)
Mrs Pink Banned Mrs Pink's Profile Albums Mrs Pink's Photo Gallery Join Date: 9th May, 2007 Location: near Glasgow Posts: 616 My Mood: Rep Power: 0 Diet: Cambridge	Hiya I often observe skinnies to see what they do .... the ones I have observed (!) take smaller portions than me (I eat like the proverbial Irish Navvie) eat far slower than me (keeping up the similes, I wolf it down like a Dobermann that hasn't seen food for 48 hours) and they often leave food on their plate (not me! I clear mine then eye up everyone else's, such is my abhorrence of "waste"...) I think these are the roots of my problem ... how to overcome these habits of a lifetime? Oh and I am intrigued by your "off to meet a priest" throwaway comment - was that to ask about his nutritional habits, or to find out the Official modern stance on Gluttony?! cheers mrs pink