Discussion in 'Lighter Life Forum' started by fatpossum, 9 May 2007 Social URL.

  1. fatpossum

    fatpossum Silver Member

    Does exercise assist with weight loss loss on the LL diet.

    I should imagine that it would but the LLC said that it would make little difference(!)

    How can that be? Quite apart from the calories necessary to sustain ones BMR, if one is taking in only 500 calories and expends 300-400 on exercise, surely that must make a difference in terms of weight loss.

    The LLC's locum told me something even more curious i.e. that those on the LL diet should avoid exercises that might result in muscle building because muscle weighs heavier than fat and consequently those who exercise run the risk of being disappointed at the weigh in. That seems a bit daft to me - building and toning muscle during weight loss has to be highly desirable - if one has the energy to do it.

    Puzzled Fatpossum :confused:
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  3. Kate

    Kate CDC/PT/PITA

    Mmm. I hear this one a lot. You can't build muscle on a VLCD. All you can do is maintain the muscle you've got. It's a very good idea to do some resistance exercise for that very reason, and a very good idea to do some cardio in order to keep fit and healthy. There are so many benefits to exercise other than weight loss.

    I do, however, see where your LLC is coming from about exercise not making a difference. You should not be doing so much on a VLCD that you're burning sufficient calories to make a significant difference to your weight loss. It takes a lot of effort to burn 300-400 calories, believe me. If you're making that kind of effort on a daily basis (because you'd have to, if you wanted to burn an extra half pound a week) while on a VLCD you'd be running the risk of your body burning some muscle for fuel thus defeating the whole point of exercising.
  4. Hiddenfishcake

    Hiddenfishcake Full Member

    My understanding is this:

    To begin with exercise should only be taken if you are up to it, depending on your current levels of fitness. Cardio type exercise will help you to lose some more weight and will increase inches loss. Weights will help you with muscle tone.

    There is certainly an element of exercise encouraged by LL as they give out exercise DVDs and equipment along the way. I was actually told by my LLC that I would have to look like Popeye to have put on that much muscle for it to actually really show on the scales.

    I think what they're trying to tell you is that you could easily not lose any more than you would have done if you didn't exercise, and therefore they don't want to build unrealistic expectations for you when you get weighed each week.

    You will find though that better fitness and increased muscle tone will help your metabolism for when you do reintroduce food.

    Personally, I think if you have the energy to do something then go for it. This is all about getting out of old habits and making changes, and exercise is a great new habit to get into!
  5. Russiandoll

    Russiandoll Carpe diem

    Start Weight:
    Current Weight:
    Goal Weight:
    Cambridge Weight Plan - Step 1
    Think about it FP .... if you're intake is 500 cals and you're expending 400 then your poor body has just 100 cals to survive on.
    The liklihood is that it would go into severe starvation mode and start depleting muscle which is something we want to minimise on a VLCD.

    We just aren't taking in sufficient carbs to sustain heavy cardio workouts - moderate gentle exercise is the way to go. Good for body and mind :)
  6. fatpossum

    fatpossum Silver Member

    Thanks Chaps,

    I am and have been a regular exerciser for the past 9 years - I just want to keep it up and feel that I am being put off by the comments of the LLC.
  7. Lighter me

    Lighter me Member

    Lighter Life
    Hi Fatpossum,

    I spoke to my counsellor at last night weigh in and she said that everyone within the first 100 days will loose 3 stone (or more) as long as they stick to the programme regardless of fitness level and being able to exercise or not, she siad of course for well being and self motivation exercise is a great thing to be doing for yourself and lots of peoples SMART goals are set around exercise, even a walk around the bock may not be possible for some people and to loose weight will enable them to get active. I am sure after exercising for 9 years you would take a lot more than 1 persons comments to put you off! thats almost a life time habit:)

    And as far as "existing" on 500+ calories each day that is a myth! because we have the packs for the nutrition, we go into Ketois and our body naturally eats up all the extra calories we need from our own store so we are have enough calories each day, just internally rather than externally, Makes sense to me:)

    I always read your posts with such interest, I wonder if you have expressed your concerns regarding your counseller, the diet ect with the counsellor or the HQ because you don't seem very satisfied with the whole thing and the same weight loss can be had from the CD, I am going to switch I think after I have completed my frst 100 days. I think:eek: ! see how I feel!

    Lighter Me
  8. gaijingirl

    gaijingirl has lying hips

    FP - I have continued to exercise pretty much throughout doing LL. BUT - I do find I need to take it easier - I can't exercise to the intensity I do when eating. I have commuted by bicycle every day (14 mile round trip) and swam most days throughout, as well as playing badminton (which bizarrely was the thing that I found hardest on LL - even though I've always thought of it as gentle). But I took it easy with all of these. My partner, with whom I cycle a lot, also definitely noticed that I was much slower cycling - I just found I didn't have the energy to really push myself. I think that maintaining a gentle exercise routine is fine - and you seem to want to maintain what you were doing so that will probably be cool. But it's not a time to decide to join the gym and really go for it when you haven't been doing that before.

    I, personally, find the exercise thing a bit frustrating with LL as I do really enjoy it - but when I had a LL break recently and went running I was so amazed at the difference 6+ stone weight loss makes, it was worth the weight.

    I'm currently on a 4 week (ish) course of abstinence to finish off that last little bit of weight loss and I have more or less stopped all exercise for this last little push, the fact it's raining and I am in revision hell is also a factor - but I still cycle several times a week (otherwise I'd go bonkers!).

    Then, after coming off, I have the London-Brighton bike ride followed by the London Triathlon to train for.... :eek: :eek:

    PS.. I also notice that you don't seem, from your posts, very pleased overall with LL.... I know it's not for everyone, but are you not noticing good results - apart from your pelvic floor!?
  9. NICKY

    NICKY Full Member

    I Am Really Glad That This Came Up Coz I Dutifully Joined A Gym At The Same Time As Ll And My Instructor Was Not That Keen To Devise A Programme For Me
    So Now After Reading All This I Will Stick To My Thrice Weekly Swim And Leave The Gym Until I Reach Goal
    Many Thanks All Of You
  10. fatpossum

    fatpossum Silver Member

    Hi gaijingirl,

    It is true that I am not altogether happy with all aspects of the LL programme. I think that people in my area have been 'sold short' in terms of access to LL. It's not as if we have a choice of group we don't - not unless we are prepared to travel a minimum of 2 hours each way in order to get to the next nearest group - so not an option!

    Our counsellor is very poor and the sessions shambolic - this is not just a gripey criticism (as some people have suggested to me since joining this forum - I felt this to be quite unfair given that my disquite is quite genuine) and I am not the only member of our group to have these concerns. Five of us stood outside the LL office on Monday night last after the 'group' and spoke about how poor the 'counselling' element is - the counsellor hasn't a clue and I am sure she has had a charisma bypass!

    I do however like the fact that I am losing lots of weight but parts of me are now skinny enough (I'd like to be able to target my middle region and leave the rest of me as it is - I can see and feel bones all over my torso - yuk!). I am fully committed to my four packs a day and several gallons of water.

    I also like the women in the group some of whom are extremely interesting and complex. But these discoveries are not made during the 'counselling session' (groan!!) but when we all chat together when the counsellor is out of the room.

    To be honest if I could get the packs as cheaply on Ebay I would. Having to endure two hours each week in order to get the packs is quite a bind. It costs me even more money because as a mother of two children I have to employ a baby sitter at £5.00 an hour!! - so LL costs me £76 a week and not £66.

    I plan to stay the course however - I don't want to have to break in another programme at this stage. I shall just continue to bemoan my lot.

    Thanks for your interest.
  11. Brad0053

    Brad0053 Silver Member

    I might has missed something while skim reading, so forgive me if I have.

    FP - If you don't get anything from the sessions and appear to resent going and taking up your time, why don't you switch to Cambridge?

    If it is a case of having to travel to see somebody, you dont have to stay that long and you could make arrangements with your counsellor to see them less frequently than once a week.

    Would that not be problem solved, or do you think you benefit from spending the time with the other people who attend the sessions, regardless of your view of your LLC?
  12. fatpossum

    fatpossum Silver Member

    Hi Brad,

    As outlined in my earlier post I am gaining benefits from LL in terms of weight loss and I do enjoy talking with the other women.

    I just feel that people in my area have "been sold a pup" in terms of the LL "package". I fully accept that other people in other areas enjoy the input of excellent cousellors - we don't have that.

    As I have said earlier, I am not in a position to travel to another group and I don't want to switch mid way through so I have decided to percevere.

    Don't you think that if your experience was similar to mine that you might be just a little bit peeved? It's not sour grapes - the whole thing is shambolic.

    **The first week we did nothing in terms of group work.
    **The second week was reduced to less than an hour because of a staffing issues.
    **The third week involved two new people joining so again we did very little "work" due to them needing to be weighed in etc. (They have been lovely additions as individuals but the LLC's managment of the new arrivals was disruptive).
    **The following week more people joined so yet more disruption.
    **The LLC has run out of packs on more than one occasion and unless we were all prepared to have savoury 4 times a day for two days we were stuffed (or not stuffed as the case was!).
    **We don't even have enough chairs to sit on - three of us have had to sit on the floor round the corner from the tv on which we are supposed to view the video.
    **Pop ins are not on offer
    **The LLC is often uncontactable and people have waited up to three days for a response to a telephone message.

    I don't think that the service is good enough but because of where I live my options are limited.

    On a more positive note, I am losing weight and I consider that to be worth the frustration.
  13. fatpossum

    fatpossum Silver Member


    :wave_cry: Oh and Brad,

    travelling to another group would involve a 4 hours round trip so even if I didn't stay very long it is not feasible.

  14. gaijingirl

    gaijingirl has lying hips

    Well I think that you're getting a very rough deal. I changed my counsellor several weeks into foundation myself and now travel about 3 times as far as I really need to - BUT I have loads of choice of counsellors in my area (London) - so it still means a journey of under an hour!

    I would be very tempted to switch to Cambridge though if I were you - you wouldn't need to break it in - it would be a simple switch I think. Most of their foodpacks are manufactured by the same company anyway - it's essentially the same thing you are consuming (in fact I have some leftover Cambridge packs that a friend gave me which I've used in times of crisis). The fact that it's half price, you don't have the counselling element anyway, you wouldn't need to get childcare as you'd just be popping in to buy your foodpacks etc would all be bonuses given the situation you describe. I don't know if you've checked out Cambridge counsellors in your area but they may even be really close to you! The only problem would be their add a meal week which personally I would not be keen on.

    Failing that I would definitely phone LL HQ to complain. They seem to be quite quick to take action in such cases and I expect they would agree that you are not getting the kind of service they aim to provide.

    It's good that you're losing weight though - and I know exactly what you mean about the losing it around the stomach thing - I'm at the stage now where I don't know if its fat or just loose skin anymore? How can you tell if leftover flab is fat or skin?? either way it's all around my stomach... :(

    I hope you get something sorted out - it sounds a bit pants tbh!
  15. Brad0053

    Brad0053 Silver Member

    Well I agree that you have not had a particularly positive experience.

    I suppose my rhetorical question to you is what are you going to do about it. You pay not an inconsiderable amount of money for a product AND service and you don't appear to be getting VFM. If you were to go to a hairdresser near you who gave you a crap haircut, week after week, you wouldn't go back, you would source another service provider - why treat your diet experience any differently.

    Regardless of the 4 hours, you would only need to do that once a month, assuming your 'local' CDC does not travel. It would still be over the month less time and more importantly a lot less money for you.

    Whatever you decide FP, best wishes and good luck with your journey.
  16. Cerulean

    Cerulean Gold Member

    Start Weight:
    Current Weight:
    Goal Weight:
    CD Step 5/Low GI
    FP - all of those things you mention are in contravention to the customer agreement you have with LL - you MUST contact head office and tell them. You are paying a lot of money for this and it is their responsibility to deliver - or at the very least get the counsellor trained so that they are giving you the service you need. You're not on the IoW are you?

    Anyway - the exercise!

    If you read the instructions we are supposed to be walking at least 10000 steps a day. For most people who are obese this comes to around about a 500 calorie burn (not counting the exercise DVD they give us) so the theories about using up too many of the calories aren't correct as LL are already encouraging us to use up the calories that we get from the food packs.

    I believe that at 4st 10 lost in foundation I am one of the speedier losers and I have exercised at least 3 days a week throughout foundation (after week 3). I am doing a disciplined but relatively gentle (ie not Astanga) form of yoga called Iyengar that concentrates on the quality of the poses that you do and my thigh and calf muscles are really building nicely under the remaining flab and it really strengthens your arms and shoulders - I have lost 7 inches off the tops of my arms (almost half the circumference) and although I do have stretch marks and faint bingo wings, just 6 weeks of yoga has really started to sort this out for me!

    I cycle about 15 miles a week and walk at least 10 miles and I do 1 hour 15 mins of yoga. I am losing approximately a stone every 3-4 weeks which is fast for a woman. I know everyone is different.

    Also LL say that in order to lose 3 stone you would need to walk to Gibraltar and back (on a calorie controlled diet). What they are saying here is that losing weight by just exercising takes a long time - they are not saying that you shouldn't exercise at all - but I think some counsellors want their clients to stay motivated so anything that might cause a slow loss one week is regarded as negative.
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