AJ's LL Management Journey!

[AmandaJayne]

"I hope I can continue on my own journey and keep on the straight and narrow "

Sam, thanks for your comments, there's no reason why you shouldn't!

Kath, so pleased that you made the decision that's right for you.

Cake, Yes, I'll will continue with the popins - I will need them!

Had out meeting tonight and found that I'd lost another 2 lb. Surprised! That's me at 10.8!

We talked about my doing the programme in 'adapted child' mode. Yes, that's how I've been doing the whole programme. I have followed the rules faithfully. Therefore it will be interesting to see how I cope after the structure of the 12 week programme. Effectively there will be no external structure to follow so I will have to rely on my own.

I still feel like I am hovering over a precipice and am picking my way carefully along the path, not daring to deviate or make any 'mistakes'. However, one day I will cock it up so need to prepare for that and not overreact and turn it into an opportunity for a blowout!

Perhaps I should have more faith in myself to cope this time. Surely I have learned my lessons well this time?

" guess its all a matter of re-educating the ole tastebuds"

I think you're absolutely right Cake, relying on fat, salt and sugar to flavour everything is so limiting. Now, learning to use a wide variety of spices and herbs, and actually appreciating the flavours of veg, meat, fish, fruit etc., WITHOUT soaking them in salt, fat and sugar, well it's a revelation!

It will be easy to continue with this habit and frankly, why would anyone want to revert to eating foods stuffed with salt, sugar or fat?

 

[Joolz]

"
We talked about my doing the programme in 'adapted child' mode. Yes, that's how I've been doing the whole programme. I have followed the rules faithfully. Therefore it will be interesting to see how I cope after the structure of the 12 week programme. Effectively there will be no external structure to follow so I will have to rely on my own.

I still feel like I am hovering over a precipice and am picking my way carefully along the path, not daring to deviate or make any 'mistakes'. However, one day I will cock it up so need to prepare for that and not overreact and turn it into an opportunity for a blowout!

Perhaps I should have more faith in myself to cope this time. Surely I have learned my lessons well this time?

quote]

Hi AJ - its interesting what you say here, as like you I am following Management to the letter (Week 2 for me) and it is "Adapted child mode" but my hope is that using this 12 weeks as a process of food re-education is very important before I sail solo so to speak.

You WILL overindulge at some point but all the lessons learned and now in your brain will enable you to treat it as a lapse and nothing more. Not a major setback, not an excuse to go back to old habits. Yes you should have more faith in yourself as you are a very determined lady.

Week 2 for me is going fine after my initial worries that all this "extra food in Week 2" would make me put on weight. I have my pop in with LLC later and that will help I'm sure.

Also I have a question - you refer a lot to having hot oranges for breakfast - I can have fruit from Week 3 and wondered how you made them, I haven't seen anything in the recipe book. Just preparing myself for yummy fruit for when I get to Week 3...

Joolz x

 

[AmandaJayne]

Hia there Joolz,

Thanks for your words of wisdom. Sometimes it is difficult to see the wood for the trees!

Firstly, I adapted the hot oranges recipe from one on page 21 of the weeks 1-4 recipe booklet. My method is as follows:-

Take 2 oranges, peel and slice them. Put them in a microwave dish, sprinkle ginger and cinnamon on (to your taste), mix the sliced oranges around to coat them all nicely. Cook on high for 2 mins. Get a nice dish out of the cupboard and pile the hot yummy oranges in it, grab a fork, and get stuck in.

Try it with just cinnamon, or just ginger, for a change.

A real winter warmer!

More about 'adapted child' syndrome, I suppose it is an improvement on my previous 'rebellious child' habits!

However, at what point am I behaving in 'adult' mode. What exactly does someone in 'adult' mode do when following the 12 weeks of Management? Wouldn't an 'adult' also follow the rules like I did? Is it about following the rules out of FEAR of failure (which is an adapted child response)? Would someone in 'adult' mode follow the rules because it is the right thing to do (but not out of fear of consequences)?

It is confusing.

Anyway, at least I am following the rules!

 

[Helen]

Hi AJ

Just posting to say "thanks" for such a fantastic diary! I can't wait to read it everyday. I was very worried about management (though I won't be there until about September) and your story has helped me so much. I am in week 7 with 5-6 stone left to lose - your diary is so inspirational I have much more faith now that I can do this! Congratulations on a fantastic achievement!!!!!!!!

 

[Joolz]

Hia there Joolz,

Thanks for your words of wisdom. Sometimes it is difficult to see the wood for the trees!

Firstly, I adapted the hot oranges recipe from one on page 21 of the weeks 1-4 recipe booklet. My method is as follows:-

Take 2 oranges, peel and slice them. Put them in a microwave dish, sprinkle ginger and cinnamon on (to your taste), mix the sliced oranges around to coat them all nicely. Cook on high for 2 mins. Get a nice dish out of the cupboard and pile the hot yummy oranges in it, grab a fork, and get stuck in.

Try it with just cinnamon, or just ginger, for a change.

A real winter warmer!


More about 'adapted child' syndrome, I suppose it is an improvement on my previous 'rebellious child' habits!

However, at what point am I behaving in 'adult' mode. What exactly does someone in 'adult' mode do when following the 12 weeks of Management? Wouldn't an 'adult' also follow the rules like I did? Is it about following the rules out of FEAR of failure (which is an adapted child response)? Would someone in 'adult' mode follow the rules because it is the right thing to do (but not out of fear of consequences)?

It is confusing.

Anyway, at least I am following the rules!

Thanks AJ - that sounds devine and will be useful as a winter brekkie - so looking forward to having fruit again but a few more days to go for me in Week 2 first...

Interesting debate. I am defo following the rules because I am terrified of not coping without the rules at this stage, and so far LL in foundation, development and management has not let me down (nor indeed have I let myself down!) so I agree that is adapted child, but maybe there is a bit of adult in there too as I am doing this because I want to and I want to be "trained" for healthy eating for the rest of my life. Food for thought (well the thoughts are calorie free).

 

[sukie sue]

Hia there Joolz,

Thanks for your words of wisdom. Sometimes it is difficult to see the wood for the trees!

Firstly, I adapted the hot oranges recipe from one on page 21 of the weeks 1-4 recipe booklet. My method is as follows:-

Take 2 oranges, peel and slice them. Put them in a microwave dish, sprinkle ginger and cinnamon on (to your taste), mix the sliced oranges around to coat them all nicely. Cook on high for 2 mins. Get a nice dish out of the cupboard and pile the hot yummy oranges in it, grab a fork, and get stuck in.

Try it with just cinnamon, or just ginger, for a change.

A real winter warmer!

More about 'adapted child' syndrome, I suppose it is an improvement on my previous 'rebellious child' habits!

However, at what point am I behaving in 'adult' mode. What exactly does someone in 'adult' mode do when following the 12 weeks of Management? Wouldn't an 'adult' also follow the rules like I did? Is it about following the rules out of FEAR of failure (which is an adapted child response)? Would someone in 'adult' mode follow the rules because it is the right thing to do (but not out of fear of consequences)?

It is confusing.

Anyway, at least I am following the rules!

aj you are sooo right !!!!
ive been reading your thread of conversation with joolz regardin this and im thinking well i must be in adapted child mode then as im following the programme to the letter, but where does one end and the other start ??? who knows , maybey our adult self will need to kick in when we stumble to be relied on to make the right decisions in times of struggle and temptation???? i dont know , all i know is i will do EVERYTHING in my power to stick with this , carry it forward into my life and do whatever it takes not to go 'back' to what we are all running from
sue xx

 

[WobblyW]

Thanks AJ - that sounds devine and will be useful as a winter brekkie - so looking forward to having fruit again but a few more days to go for me in Week 2 first...

Interesting debate. I am defo following the rules because I am terrified of not coping without the rules at this stage, and so far LL in foundation, development and management has not let me down (nor indeed have I let myself down!) so I agree that is adapted child, but maybe there is a bit of adult in there too as I am doing this because I want to and I want to be "trained" for healthy eating for the rest of my life. Food for thought (well the thoughts are calorie free).

Very interesting debate: Isn't the point of all this, not whether you follow the plan to the letter, but why and how you deal with it when you don't? Or whether you feel able to deviate at all. Therefore a decision to have some fruit for instance prior to when you are supposed to, may or may not be an adult decision depending on your thought processes at the time, and your reaction to that. After all, no one will always be within the safety blanket of not feeling hungry in ketosis, and therefore situations will arise where temptations in many forms will arise, and it is the thought processes and decisions we make at that time that are important.

It's interesting even in management people still feel that 'they let themselves down' if they deviate from the plan. Perhaps if you are one of those people you need to explore your thought processes more deeply and pick them apart.

Sorry this is deep, but I do find this interesting.
W

 

[AmandaJayne]

Wobbly, you go as deep as you want!

There've been some really interesting questions raised during this discussion, and I for one have found it very helpful. I've been posting on Karion's thread about a similar subject and she is a real fount of knowledge and experience. I suggest you have a look (if you haven't already) at her manintenance diary thread (I can't remember the name of it, but will post it when I do).

We were talking about TRIGGER foods. I am pretty sure that mine will be sugar related (week 12) and have been agonising about what to do. I am so afraid that if I eat chocolate it will be like 'opening the floodgates' and it will lead to a binge. I had decided that I just wouldn't eat any of the sugar/chocolate/cake/sweet related trigger foods at all, then I would be safe, wouldn't I?

Karion (who has been maintaining for nearly 2 years now), said that she deliberately eats her trigger foods and it has helped her to deal with the feelings they create. Which actually makes a lot of sense. So, I have revised my decision and WILL incorporate sugar/chocolate related foods on a regular basis and go into 'adult' mode when the cravings appear. There, I've made a decision in 'adult' mode rather than 'adapted child' mode (fear based).

I have to tell you all that my back 'went' yesterday leaving me hobbling about like a old woman. It is truly horrendous. It hasn't flared up for about 3 years and a woman osteopath living in Llandudno fixed it for me in one session! I am going to see her again in April for another session. In the meantime, I phoned NHS24 this morning and they have arranged an appointment for 10.30 at our local A&E to be treated/or get strong painkillers/anti-inflametories (sp.) - anything really just to take the edge off and let me get by until I can get to Llandudno.

Foodwise yesterday I started with porridge and a pear, then an apple at playtime. Lunch at the pub was chile con carne with rice. I ate half and took the rest home. Had it for tea with spinach/raita. Hot chocolate for supper, and a plum.

Not had anything today, but willl hobble to the kitchen an make my porridge!

Gotta go now.

 

[Joolz]

Hi AJ - Sorry to hear your back has gone. how debilitating.

hope you manage to get some relief from your trip to A+E.

The whole approach to weight management being discussed here is very interesting - and I like the fact it's deep too! I will have a look at Karion's thread when I have more time.

I do agree it is HOW we deal with the thoughts around lapses, cravings, reactions to life events involving food etc which will either establish us as women who had weight problems but have now learned to deal with them in an adult way and become a successful weight holder OR a yo-yoer who knows the rules but uses food as a prop for whatever reason and then goes back to healthy eating when times are less stressed. I know I want to be the former but I still have a long way to go.

I think it is a sensible choice to re-introduce your trigger foods and see what it does to your body and mind and that way learn how to deal with the issues that MAY arise, rather than banning them from your life completely. Of course you may find that the triggers you once had are now not your triggers at all....

Take care hun, Joolz x

 

[sukie sue]

poor you aj
i really hope you found some relief at a ne theres nothing worse .xx
take care

 

[AmandaJayne]

Can't believe it's been three days since I posted here.

Back is still very painful and have been signed of work for a week - a first for me who never takes time off.

Had our meeting tonight. I start week 10 which is cheese. Not sure how I feel about this one.

Lost another couple of lbs, now 10.6 1/2. I guess that's because of the sore back which has reduced my appetite somewhat. I was surprised though because my activity level is virtually nil at the moment.

Feeling unsettled. I think it's probably because I've been forced to change my routine and the lack of activity has thrown me. Was a bit silly today because I went into son's bedroom and started tidying it up. I couldn't seem to help myself and struggled for a while before giving up.

I found his stash of sweeties and empty wrappers. Does he really imagine I don't know about these things? Heaven knows, I used to do it myself - a past master. What I am going to do with him? How can I deal with this?

When I was in a very bad place last year, I was consumed with terrible thoughts about my son, and the bleak future he faced if he continued to develop the (awful) traits I have myself. I even wondered if I should do the right thing and end his life (and mine too). I mean, it crossed my mind that I would be doing him a favour by protecting him from an awful future. How crazy is that? Fortunately at this point I sought help from my GP. I can certainly understand why women who are in a depths of depression can kill themselves and their kids though, they only want to protect them from a seeminlgy unbearable future. I am glad I got help, the pills gave me a breathing space while I got better. I stopped taking them towards the end of last year. That time of my life seems like a distant nightmare that I never want to revisit.

Anyway, Karion had suggested that I have a look at the Weight Loss Resources site because it's helped her with her food choices.

It certainly was a eye opener. I have realised that I am simply not eating enough, no wonder I keep losing! I am going to sit down tomorrow and work out exactly how much I should be eating and try to work out a tasty, healthy menu for the weeks ahead. I have to do this because I have to start eating a normal diet not a diet diet. If that makes sense. I have to get out of this 'diet' mentality and move on. Glad I have finally identified this as a problem to be solved, and thank you Karion for showing me the way.

Hope you're all doing ok on your own journeys.

Take tare now.

AJ

 

[Kath]

Just wanted to send you a hug for your son AJ

As for the diet thing, yes it's time to accept that you are slim. Don't get addicted to the losing weight thing. Time to up them cals girl

 

[Cerulean]

Glad to see you up and posting again. I'd missed your updates!

As for your son - it's tricky as bringing it up might make it worse - but I think it has to be done somehow. I remember howling with tears when Dad offered to help me lose weight wen my parents noticed I was bingeing and I'm not sure it eve helped me with my problem. Its difficult to know how to share the lessons learnt about emotional eating. Maybe you could talk to him about what he wants and what makes him happy. From reading your diary you seem very wise and self-aware these days. I'm sure you'll make the right choice.

Hope your back rights itself soon. And good luck with the cheese. That's my particular nemesis so I'd be anxious going into Week 10.

 

[Goombagirl]

Hi AJ; glad you're able to post a bit and hope your back gets sorted out in Llandudno - I love it in North Wales, a few years ago we stayed at The Lighthouse on the Great Orme where we had the most enormous cooked breakfast. We gobbled it up and then the dog came in for the leftovers - apparently it was rare for people to finish it!! Just shows how firmly we'd both been brought up to finish what's on the plate. I hope I wouldn't do that now though.

Re your son: I have a 14 yr old who has my food habits i.e. overeating (the 12 yr old is like his dad and stops when he's had enough). He is getting a bit chubby and does eat when he's upset (more frequent now with the raging hormones). I've been talking to him about food/emotions and I think he's starting to take it on board. He says he'd like to do LL (!) but obviously not appropriate as he's not in the state I was and far too young. I feel terrible about him saying that - what messages have I been giving him? One thing which has helped was a Dorling Kindersley book I got out of the library called Perfect Portion by Linda Gassenheimer. It's got lots of photos of what is a healthy portion size and is really powerful. It had an immediate effect on him (and me). There's a long way to go but I hope that as my attitudes change he'll pick up on the healthy eating thing. There certainly will be (and have been) changes in the house menu! Another book I've been greatly helped by is Eating Less which I heard about via a post from Pixie - I'm seriously considering working through it with him as he's quite interested in psychology. He's already using one of the tools from it (times and plans).

Thanks again for doing this brilliant thread - I'm going to be rereading it avidly in a month or so when I start management!

 

[AmandaJayne]

Oh Goombagirl! I had such a giggle when I read your story about the big breakfast. I could just imagine the dogs face when he saw the clean plates! Hehehe.

Thanks so much for your insights into your son's eating behaviours. It's good to know I'm not alone. Jamie is really slim and healthy (at the moment) and that's because he never stops moving, always on the go! Often cakes or biscuits go missing from the kitchen and I know it's him taking them. I wonder if the answer is simply to not have them in the house? It's come to the point where I give my daughter a packet of biscuits to keep in her bedroom, because otherwise she never gets one! I can trust that she won't eat them all at once, because she's like her father!

I don't want Jamie to feel bad about what he's doing, because I've lived with the shame for many years and it is such a destructive emotion. Of course, it is difficult to be objective when it concerns someone who you love so overwhelmingly, but I am trying to step back and view the problem objectively. I cannot help him if I get all emotional!

Cerulean - thanks so much for your insights. You are right though, it's a really tricky area to deal with. I think I can start with not being judgemental, and also being honest with Jamie about MY experiences, just so he knows that (a) I know all the tricks in the book and (b) he can talk to me about how he feels knowing that I understand.

Hia Kath, yes, yes it IS time I accepted that I am slim. I promise to up the intake! In fact, it should be a bit easier because cheese is back on the menu and is notoriously high in calories! Also, bread is back next week and I am intending to eat high quality, high fibre speciality bread which I know has many calories. QUALITY rather than QUANTITY from now on!

Cheese. I've just been to the supermarket and bought a small piece of Wensledale with berries. I am going to have a 40g piece with a baked sweet potato and salad at lunchtime.

Again, if I eat cheese from now on, it will be based to its quality and taste, rather than quantity and cheapness. I think that emphasising this aspect of choosing food items, rather than focusing on 'low fat' or 'cheap' will be a good beginning.

 

[KD]

I wonder if the answer is simply to not have them in the house?

They do say that is the best solution. Better than utting a restriction on it as it only makes it more exciting.

It is a difficult one, especially as boys seem to go through times when they need an extraordinary amount of calories!!

I think that emphasising this aspect of choosing food items, rather than focusing on 'low fat' or 'cheap' will be a good beginning.

Yes! Yes! Yes! Another step forward for Amanda!

 

[slimbride]

Hey AJ

Your son sounds like me when I was 15!

I don't think that not keeping the food in the house is a good plan - he will just get it from elsewhere. At least if he is taking stuff from you, you know what he is eating.

Also, encourage him to eat in front of you all if possible - I found that the secretive element of the eating was always the most destructive and I was very ashamed of it.

I'm not a mom, so please take my advice with a pinch of salt - but that was exactly how i used to feel!

xxxx

 

[AmandaJayne]

Hia Slimbride, thanks so much for your reply. It's irrelevent whether you've got kids yet. I am always appreciative of reading peoples' experiences or advice. Yes, he's very like me when I was younger - I see myself in him so often it's scary!

I do take on board what you said about him getting food from somewhere else if he can't get it from home - it's a good point. He's taken money from me before and indeed, we had a chat about this very subject a couple of days ago. He assured me that he hadn't been taking money. Sadly, he is a very good liar and I so want to believe him. His first response sometimes if he thinks I will accuse him of something is to deny, deny, deny. Often, when faced with evidence, he will then admit the truth.

Some months ago after another incident, he took pains to regain my trust in him by intentionally (!) taking things only to admit it straight away. He said to me "Well it's like this Mum, if I start telling the truth about what I'm doing, you will start to trust me again, won't you?" It's at times like this that I feel out of my depth!

Kids eh!

 

[slimbride]

God I think that being a mum is far too complicated!

I guess the only other way then, as you mentioned above, is to empathiswith him, and tell him about what you used to do (it would humanise you a bit for him )- at the mo you are his mum, the all powerful, but by pointing out your weaknesses and your past troubles he can see that you are a person as well as being a mommy, and then hopefully that will help.

But im not sure i know what im talking about!

Sorry to hear about your back - my mummy used to have countless problems until she took up swimming 3 times a week (it strengthens all the back muscles) and now she is fit as a fiddle!

 

[AmandaJayne]

Thanks, Slimbride - it's tough being a mum, but so rewarding too!

As for the swimming, I will go next week when we're on holiday. The last time we went swimming (a few weeks ago) my wonderful son said that I now looked "all wrinkley". "Look" he said pointing helpfully at my deflated thighs. Thanks son.



I've just made a pan of lentil soup, just sipping a cup of it now. Mmmm.

Yesterday I made a pan of vegetable broth and added too much pepper. Could barely eat it! Had to throw the whole lot out. Ouch.

I said earlier that I was going to have some cheese, baked potato and salad for lunch, didn't I? Well, I forgot, and it's now 2.15! I'd better get on with it once I've finished the soup!

What's my excuse? I've been on Minis!!!