AJs Maintenance Journey Part 1

Hello there Tenney,

I never really used the bars much during the latter stages, but don't see why they can't be eaten at any stage of the programme. I think the only limit is in terms of having no more than one a day, I think.

Glad you enjoyed the thread! I have done the same with other threads too, they are like a good book, unputdownable!

I've just finished watching Pans Labyrinth, a weird, disturbing fairy tale set during the Spanish Civil War. There was some nasty violence of a type I don't like, but I loved the story.

My campaign to eat more stepped up a notch today when I had some hummous with toasted ciabatta bread and carrot sticks followed by stir fried chinese veg and chicken, with hoi sin sauce. Went out for lunch and had chicken caesar salad, just left the croutons alone. Had a chopped apple, orange and pear during the day, and later for supper stewed apple, sultanas and cinnamon. Not forgetting porridge, seeds and sultanas for breakfast!
 
AJ, I have a question. I know you are trying to eat a bit more but I wonder if in the last 3-4 months when you were probably undereating a little, did you feel hungry? Or was your desire to avoid the weight gains after dieting that you'd experienced in the past so strong that you didn't really experience any significant hunger? I ask because I'm trying to unravel this physical/psychological hunger thing. I feel distinctly peckish at times, but have been the same weight for a couple of weeks. Is my mind playing tricks on me? Thanks! By the way, your meals today sound delicious. And your will power in leaving the croutons is astounding!
 
"....but I wonder if in the last 3-4 months when you were probably undereating a little, did you feel hungry?...."

Hia GG!

Short answer is 'no'. I have always ate until I was full, and recently until very full.

In an effort to distinguish between real hunger and psychological hunger I ask myself " what do you want to eat?" The answer is usually enough to figure it out!

If it is proper, good, nourishing food, and it is a meal time anyway - ok I am probably hungry.

If it is not a meal time I might have a drink first instead and wait half and hour.

If it is any of my usual triggers i.e. bread, jam, cheese, chocolate, cereal - I then ask myself "well, would you eat xxx" and substitute a healthier alternative. If the answer is 'probably not', then I am wanting to eat for another reason.

It is then up to me to (a) figure out the other reason and (b) work through the problem.

It is hard to resist the lure of giving in though. I am not always successful at preventing myself from 'switching off' and have occasionally ended up going ahead with eating the triggers anyway. However, conversely I am sometimes very successful, for which I am grateful.

The mind is a truly powerful entity. The amount of cr*p we tell ourselves in order to delude us into doing stuff which will ultimately sabotage our desire to eat healthily. We are just SO persuasive sometimes.

Visualisations can be a powerful way to fight back. It does take a lot of repetition and practice for it to start becoming effective.

Imagining in detail that you are choosing to eat a healthy diet, or making good choices in other areas of your life, eventually seeps into your subconscious and can make it easier make these good choices unconsciously.

Apparently, athletes can improve their runningtimes by using visualisation techniques. They imagine in great detail running the race and beating all the other competitors. It is something to do with reprogramming the mind. I can't remember where I read the article, but try googling 'visualisation techniques' and see what comes up.

As for the croutons, I'm not really interested in them to be honest. I always either leave them on the plate or palm them off on hubby or son!

Hope this helps...
 
In an effort to distinguish between real hunger and psychological hunger I ask myself " what do you want to eat?" The answer is usually enough to figure it out!

If it is proper, good, nourishing food, and it is a meal time anyway - ok I am probably hungry.

If it is not a meal time I might have a drink first instead and wait half and hour.

If it is any of my usual triggers i.e. bread, jam, cheese, chocolate, cereal - I then ask myself "well, would you eat xxx" and substitute a healthier alternative. If the answer is 'probably not', then I am wanting to eat for another reason.

 It is then up to me to (a) figure out the other reason and (b) work through the problem.


I am so glad I chose to read your thread (yet again!). I do love popping in to catch up, as I almost invariably find something that I hope to use once I get to the "food" stage again, although that seems to be forever away!!

The above quote from yourself, I think, will be invaluable to me. I am already aware of trigger foods (bread, cheese, chocolate, biscuits etc) and I still get the 4 o'clock cravings, every day as I drive home. I compensate now, whilst on LL, with a green tea, soda water or maybe a pack, butam quite concerned over my reaction to this once I am eating again. This was my real binge time, to the point I would force myself (!!!) to eat my evening meal afterwards, as I was so full by then! How ridiculous that sounds, but sadly very true.

To have been given the tools to analyze whether it is genuine or habitual hunger will be a huge benefit to me. I feel that my old habits are just bubbling under the surface, and (as I have already done, to my regret) I may lose th eplot completely once in a foodie situation.

I have also had great help from the Gillian Riley book, "Eating Less". Her considered opinion is that we must decide whether we a losing weight to look better, or whether it is to have greater self esteem and better health. I think initially for me it was most definately the former, my looks were the thing about me that almost literally hit most people in the eye! ( and not in a good way). I saw a home movie of myself at my daughters 8th birthday party, which was in Feb this year, and I was so disgustd with the bloated being that I had become, that this was my "eureka" moment. I HAD to change the way the world saw me.

As time has passed since starting LL, my focus has definately shifted. Yes, my looks are still important to me, and who doesnt feel better when getting fabulous strokes from all directions! (Although the chatterbox often chips in with "my lord, you must have been gross for so many people to comment now!") However, the change in my physical being is far more beneficial than I could have imagined. Thus, my self esteem is gradually on the up too, which I hope in the long run will be part of what keeps the weight from returning.

I WILL ask myself these questions to determine hunger, but I feel I will also ask myself whether I need to consider a return to the being unable to breathe well, run around, not be embarrassed about myself, and the reason for my heightened self esteem.

I am sorry this has been a long and meandering post, AJ, but as always your wisdom and words of experience will stay with me, possibly longer than those of my group, as you have already traveled the path I aim to emulate!!
 
"If it is any of my usual triggers i.e. bread, jam, cheese, chocolate, cereal - I then ask myself "well, would you eat xxx" and substitute a healthier alternative. If the answer is 'probably not', then I am wanting to eat for another reason"

Hi AJ, it's nice to find someone on here at about the same point as me.

I finished management about a month and a half ago and I had to consciously put weight on!! too. It's such a lovely and liberating feeling to say 'oops, lost another pound, better eat more today'.

I have had hard times but your quote above, is one I do myself and it's a very good tool to remember.

I too have enjoyed going out to meals and now focus on quality rather than quantity. I also enjoy having kind-of 'nights off'. I like to be able to have unhealthy nights occasionally because 'free child' is my overriding ego state and I think management wouldn't work for me if I couldn't occasionally just let go and eat things that I know are less than virtuous. The key is that I'm doing it from a place of knowledge and control and it's a conscious thing that has it's place and doesn't spiral out of control.

I do the same when out for meals too now. I normally choose the healthiest, most low-fat option not because I should but because I actually want to. When my fiance asks why I'm not having something else I can honestly say it's because I want to be the size and state I'm in more than I want x,y or z.

Thanks for sharing with all of us. It's good that I can 100% relate to everything you've said and I look forward to checking on your progress as I'm sure that with us being at around the same stage, everything you have to say will be poignant for me, not to mention loads of others!
 
Hi Sez, it's good to hear from you.

First things first. Lets have less of this 'long and meandering' nonsense. I always welcome a post from you:scale: !

There is no doubt that old habits will try and re-establish themselves and it will be an ongoing task to repel them. This I am finding out.

I am also finding out that it is possible to repel the old habits, not all the time, but enough to give me confidence to carry on.

"....but I feel I will also ask myself whether I need to consider a return to the being unable to breathe well, run around, not be embarrassed about myself....."

That's a very good point Sez and one I sometimes think about. Do I want to return to 'those' days again. No I don't. Then I can't have my cake and eat it, then!:D
 
Welcome, 6stloss

It is lovely to hear from someone who has the same 'problem' that I am grappling with.

In fact, tonight at the meeting I found I'd managed to put on 1 1/2 lbs - quite an achievement!

"....I too have enjoyed going out to meals and now focus on quality rather than quantity. I also enjoy having kind-of 'nights off'. I like to be able to have unhealthy nights occasionally because 'free child' is my overriding ego state and I think management wouldn't work for me if I couldn't occasionally just let go and eat things that I know are less than virtuous. The key is that I'm doing it from a place of knowledge and control and it's a conscious thing that has it's place and doesn't spiral out of control....."



I haven't yet given myself a 'night off'. But then again, I think that's because I am happy with my choices as they are, which brings me to your next point...

I do the same when out for meals too now. I normally choose the healthiest, most low-fat option not because I should but because I actually want to. When my fiance asks why I'm not having something else I can honestly say it's because I want to be the size and state I'm in more than I want x,y or z.

That's it in a nutshell!

Do feel free to drop in again sometime!
 
Hi AJ, thanks for that reply. I see you as the wise woman of minimins:) and really appreciate your posts.

In an effort to distinguish between real hunger and psychological hunger I ask myself " what do you want to eat?" The answer is usually enough to figure it out!

I must engrave that on the fridge! So simple. I think I have discovered the source of my "hunger" - cake! I had a tiny slice of birthday cake then my son practised making a sort of fruit cake for his cooking lesson but experimented with the ingredients so I had a little bit to see how it had turned out... The answer was...fabulous! I think he has a future as a baker. However once the sugar was in my bloodstream I wanted more, and had a battle last Friday evening as the cake tin called to me. I didn't have any but I wanted to. He's making 2 more this week at school - but I'm going to send them off with my husband for his staff. Now the sugar has gone through my system it's fine. I'm sticking to healthy low GI stuff now.

6stloss, I like the idea of your "nights off":D. I'd like to think I might be able to do that eventually but I've a way to go yet.

Sez, I love that Gillian Riley book too - there is so much sense in it. It all seems so obvious when she says it - why didn't I work it all out myself?!
 
In an effort to distinguish between real hunger and psychological hunger I ask myself " what do you want to eat?" The answer is usually enough to figure it out!

If it is proper, good, nourishing food, and it is a meal time anyway - ok I am probably hungry.

If it is not a meal time I might have a drink first instead and wait half and hour.

If it is any of my usual triggers i.e. bread, jam, cheese, chocolate, cereal - I then ask myself "well, would you eat xxx" and substitute a healthier alternative. If the answer is 'probably not', then I am wanting to eat for another reason.

It is then up to me to (a) figure out the other reason and (b) work through the problem

AJ, thanks for that eye opening piece of advice. I will certainly remember it and use it once I get to the stage of introducing food again (long way away still!).

Actually I will probably need to print out your whole thread and carry it with me!

Thanks for sharing your thoughts and advice with us all, it is invaluable:)
 
AJ,

How much water are you intaking now? Is there any food at all that you still consider completely off limits?


I have a friend who has done LL all the way through like you and she's totally terrified to go anywhere near festivals or fairs because of crepes and mushy peas served with mint. I just wonder if there will always be the fear? I know you struggle as you've said and are working on not losing anymore and I've linked her to your thread so hopefully she will see how encouraging it is.
 
Wow, what great posts. Such great advice and thoughts.

I really can't wait to join the management club and try some of these gorgeous recepies.

AJ, are you still sticking to a slight increase in the food intake and if so how are you feeling?

Goombagirl, I too am so intrigued by the physcological hunger issue and this is something that worries me as this has always been my drive to eat rather than actual hunger. Think I need to do a little research into this before I start management.

Sez, I think I my have to get a copy of that book and have a read if you say it is that good.

6stone, well done on getting through foundation and management, you sound like you have a great balance and I also hope one day I get to the stage to have a 'night off' without even realising I am. Do you find food is on your mind anymore? What kind of things to you have on these nights off? Chocolate and cakes are my big worry and I would hate never to be able to enjoy these again. I must admit at the moment all I want is healthy food!

Well, thats enough from me, had a good enjoyable read of this thread yet again AJ. Perhaps you should do a documentry (it couldn't be anyworse than Jordon and Peter could it) I think the ratings would be great.

Take care all xx
 
HI AJ :wavey:

JUST POPPING IN, ALTHOUGH I DON'T REPLY THAT MUCH I LOVE READING YOUR POST'S, GLAD TO SEE THAT YOU ARE STILL DOING SO WELL. SUCH AN INSPIRATION TO US ALL.....XXX

:party0011: :party0011: :party0011:
 
".....Perhaps you should do a documentry (it couldn't be anyworse than Jordon and Peter could it)...."


Hahaha, I had a laugh at that one, Betty.

FA, nice to hear from you, I hope you're doing ok.

Scooper, I still drink the water, less than I did though. On management you start off the 12 weeks having 4 litres, but gradually reduce this over time to 2 litres a day. After which you are advised to keep up drinking the 2 litres every day. It is quite easy to do that. I have a pint first thing, and drink water at school during the day instead of coffee, and another pint after school. I still drink coffee at other times, too.

I have a vision of mushy peas wrapped in a crepe, Scooper. Hmmm, doesn't do it for me, I have to admit!

GG, at least I CAN now have a bit of whatever my kids cook at school. They were always disappointed when I said 'no' to whatever they brought home after Home Eckies. Jamie is cooking carrot buns this week, is it anything like carrot cake, I wonder?

I'll have to seek out that Gillian Riley book that you recommended, Sez. I wonder if they have a copy at the library? I have to take a video back (overdue because I forgot all about it and will have to pay a large fine, I think) so I'll ask after paying the fine (sob). It would have been cheaper buying the blooming thing from Virgin.

I had a chat with my GP yesterday. I have to go and get an x-ray, my back is playing up again. Not as bad as last time, but I am concerned that it may become a problem again. We spoke at length about LL and I am hopeful that if anyone else approaches her, she will be willing to sign the form for them now. I asked her about having a tummy tuck on the NHS, she said it would be extremely highly unlikely! She advised me not to go abroad for one because of a bad experience one of her other patients had had after returning from having a tummy tuck in Poland. She had complications and found that doctors at her local NHS hospital were unsympathetic.

To be honest, I will probably learn to accept the loose skin, and my instinct is to keep away from hospitals, operations, pain, etc, unless it is absolutely necessary. I mean, so what if I can't feel like I can wear a bikini, is it really that important in the great scheme of things?

My daughter has been hogging the laptop to do research for a project about Gandhi. She spent all weekend on it and finally finished it last night, well past her bedtime. I proof-read it before she printed it out finally - spelling is not her strong point. She wants her own laptop and I am thinking that it may be a good idea because otherwise I will never be getting a look in! Particularly once my son needs to do research/projects too.

Anyway, I gotta get to work...
 
I agree with your instinct about avoiding hospitals! I know there is a only small statistical risk of dying under the anaesthetic (about 1/10000? - not sure) but for me I would not run any risk of leaving my kids without a mum just for the sake of a bikini.

I got my copy of Eating Less from the library and renewed it a lot! We can reserve and renew books online - very handy. I also got the Eric Berne book on TA and the Perfect Portion one this way. I then bought PP and Eating less from Amazon as I wanted to dip into them on a regular basis. My LLC now uses Perfect Portion to help show clients what a portion should look like.
 
Wow!

AJ, I've just re-read both your management threads from start to finish, and have c&p'd a lot of it into another document which I'm going to print and keep re-reading.

Today is my first day of route to management, and I still feel as if I have a very long way to go .....
 
Ha, managed to wrestle my (yes MY) laptop off daughter at last.

Made some delicious curried parsnip and apple soup (with some lentils). Surprisingly, my son does not like it. All the more for me then! I'll have to freeze some of it though.

I had put on nearly 2 lb when I went to my meeting on Monday and this puts me at the same weight as two weeks ago. I am trying to eat so I don't put any more on i.e. maintaining, and I haven't really got a clue what I'm doing. Just reacting rather than being objective. On the other hand, I recognise that this is just part of the learning experience and am not allowing myself to get uptight about putting on again.

I am thinking ahead to the holiday and am hoping to have put lots of strategies in place to cope with the 24 food environment. I am visualising me sitting down at breakfast with porridge and fresh fruit. If I go to the formal breakfast rather than the help yourself buffet, I can just order what I want rather than my eyes being overwhelmed with all the delicious goodies at the breakfast buffet.

Maybe doing the same for lunch too. I know I'm wittering on about this, but it is occupying my thoughts a lot at the moment. It is going to be the biggest challenge to date and I don't want to fail. I don't think I will this time though, mainly because of everything I have learned, and because I can see that being slim and healthy is a great place to be. I have too much to lose by screwing things up.

At our meeting on Monday we talked about my problems with chocolate and I said that it was off the menu again because I was finding it difficult just eating a bit every day and having it in the cupboard. My LLC asked everyone for ideas on how to deal with this,and one member had a good idea which I think I'll try. It is so simple I just never thought of it! Buy one bar of chocolate and share it with the family, just have a quarter each. Don't keep any in the house, just buy one for the day you want to eat it. That way I get a reasonable bit, and so does everyone else.

I will try it when we go to see Pirates of the Caribbean!

"....I know there is a only small statistical risk of dying under the anaesthetic (about 1/10000? - not sure) but for me I would not run any risk of leaving my kids without a mum just for the sake of a bikini...."

Goombabirl, you are so right. I visited a colleague who is recovering from a mastectomy after breast cancer - that puts things in perspective.

Virgogirl - I am learning to have faith in myself. It is a good skill to learn. You will too. Best of luck!
 
Hello Everyone

Sorry for not checking in for a few days; I absolutely love this thread - AJ continues to inspire us AND answer all our questions. And everyone else's contribution make it so thought provoking. AJ I keep recommending your various posts elsewhere on Minimins because I think with your experiences together with the others' questions, it's invaluable.

Anyway, I finished Foundation this week and the past week I've been grappling with eating when not physically hungry. Yesterday, I found some Nutella in the fridge and had some. It's not the volume I had (not much) but why I had it.

I had a look on Minimins (and the net); someone posted this, which I thought was fantastic:

"If hunger is not the problem, food is not the answer". Says it all, really, doesn't it.

Another area that I am thinking about is the issue of wanting food when I see it (we've discussed this here) and it relates to AJ's chocolate question. The answer from your group is very good; are you going to try it? Also, AJ, have you thought about trying Paul McKenna's techniques now that you are out of management? I've written about it on my blog but if you go straight to the GMTV website, you can see the fundamental principles and small videos online.

His approach is all about making no food forbidden ie we lose our obsession/fear around certain foods so that we can be around them but not feel compelled to eat them. I know people have lost a lot of weight with his system but I have come to the conclusion that it's probably more effective once you are in management and beyond.

Anyway, had better get ready for work; thanks, everyone for keeping this thread going. It's so helpful.

Have a lovely weekend everyone.

Mrs L xxxxxxxxx
 
Oh, forgot to say because my post wasn't clear - I've gone from Foundation...to Development so not supposed to be eating ANY food right now!

LOL!

Mrs L xxxx
 
Mornin' Mrs L!

Yes, I've looked into Paul McKennas ideas and try to follow his 'eat when hungry', 'eat slowly, savour every bite', thinking. I agree that it is important not to demonize certain foods (i.e. chocolate) because it sets up an immediate reaction of wanting them.

The way to success is to change what want to eat in our heads so that the things we choose to eat are automatically good for us, and we don't want to eat 'rubbish', through genuine choice.

That will take the struggle out of the whole eating thing, and it'll be easy!

I think I will try the idea of buying a bar of chocolate and sharing it, so we all get a bit, and there is none left lying around tempting me!

Gotta get ready for work, speak to you soon!
 
You're not wittering, AJ - and I think it's vital to look ahead to what must be one of the most challenging food environments ther is - a cruise ship. This visualisation approach must be a good way to anticipate situations - I really must work on that; it doesn't come naturally to me.

I've read Paul McKenna's book and it's very sensible. The bit that stays with me is how thin people think - not quite like my mind! I don't think I am good at recognising feeling full though. As you say, changing your "wants" is the way ahead. The same sort of issues are explored in the Eating Less book Sez mentioned. I cannot speak too highly of that book!!

"If hunger is not the problem, food is not the answer".

I like that, Mrs L! Another thing to put on the fridge.
 
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