Christmas on Lighter Life Total
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slendablenda
Gold Member
Me too Daisy. It was the toast that did for him, wasn't it?
I learnt from that to keep a spare sachet in my work drawer and another in the car - just in case.
I miss Pete on here. He was fun and a mine of information. I hope he's doing fine. He really got into exercise so hopefully he's managing okay.
I often wonder about Magda too. Hope she'll pop back sometime and let us know how she's doing.
I learnt from that to keep a spare sachet in my work drawer and another in the car - just in case.
I miss Pete on here. He was fun and a mine of information. I hope he's doing fine. He really got into exercise so hopefully he's managing okay.
I often wonder about Magda too. Hope she'll pop back sometime and let us know how she's doing.
Blonde Logic
Yes. You can.
Well, here is my take on Lighter Life Pandora. We are all here, doing a rather hardcore diet, because conventional diets have not worked for us in the past. Yes, an assumption, but I believe a fairly accurate one.
I think saying that encouraging someone to stick to something they have comitted to and are working hard on, to hit their goal is "demonising food" is a bit OTT. Are we not here to help each other get to goal? RIght?
From what I have seen here on my 3 years on this forum, is very strong willed people fall when they stray. Yes - there are loads here who lapse - planned or otherwise - but by doing so many of them strugle to get back to the same place of commitment they werein when they started - and many never do. And usually end up doing this diet a lot longer then necessary. So, using the experienvce I have here, I would never encourage someone to eat for any reason.
What I have garnered from the group support classes, that for about 90% of us, we are here becuase food is some kind of addiction for us. Not because we had a couple of fancy weekends out and put on a few pounds over summer - but because we have lifelong issues with food.
You would not tell a heroin addict that was coming clean after months of hard work to go ahead and have a little jab cause it was chrstimas, would you? Or pour an alcoholic a drink?, etc. For thsoe of us, and I do not make any assumption that it is anyone in paticular on this thred - to be clear - but for many who are addicted to food, its a dangerous slippery slope. Simple as.
If you are strong enough and can do it - that is great, and good for you - but I will ever encourage someone to lapse - the risk just is not worth it. And no one know if they are strong enough until they take the chance and then find out it they are not as strong as they thought, and it was not worth it.
The whole point of LL is to change the way we view food in our lives. My point simply being Christmas is not about food. We have let it become about food - but at the end of the day, that is the last thing Christmas is about.
So - ther eyou have it. In a nutshell. I am one who strongly beleives a zero-tolerance whilst on the diet is the correct and easiest and most effective and beneficial approach....and I will always stnad by that with no shame or apology.
Demonise food? Pah. I love food. And embrace food. But strive to do so correctly, wisely and for the right reason - not because there is a holiday printed on a calander.
So by all means - if a few bites of turkey - which will taste the same as they did a year ago, and will taste the same as they will a year from now - is worth risking it - then by all means, indulge and enjoy. But it is not what I would encourage anyone to do.
We all have our approaches, and I wish every single person here success - and will continue to do what I feel is right - as will you.
We don;t all have to agree, but should be free to support as we feel is in the best interest of those we care about.
Sincerest apologies if my approach has upset anyone – it is just something I feel very strongly about, and have always been one to stand by my convictions.
I think saying that encouraging someone to stick to something they have comitted to and are working hard on, to hit their goal is "demonising food" is a bit OTT. Are we not here to help each other get to goal? RIght?
From what I have seen here on my 3 years on this forum, is very strong willed people fall when they stray. Yes - there are loads here who lapse - planned or otherwise - but by doing so many of them strugle to get back to the same place of commitment they werein when they started - and many never do. And usually end up doing this diet a lot longer then necessary. So, using the experienvce I have here, I would never encourage someone to eat for any reason.
What I have garnered from the group support classes, that for about 90% of us, we are here becuase food is some kind of addiction for us. Not because we had a couple of fancy weekends out and put on a few pounds over summer - but because we have lifelong issues with food.
You would not tell a heroin addict that was coming clean after months of hard work to go ahead and have a little jab cause it was chrstimas, would you? Or pour an alcoholic a drink?, etc. For thsoe of us, and I do not make any assumption that it is anyone in paticular on this thred - to be clear - but for many who are addicted to food, its a dangerous slippery slope. Simple as.
If you are strong enough and can do it - that is great, and good for you - but I will ever encourage someone to lapse - the risk just is not worth it. And no one know if they are strong enough until they take the chance and then find out it they are not as strong as they thought, and it was not worth it.
The whole point of LL is to change the way we view food in our lives. My point simply being Christmas is not about food. We have let it become about food - but at the end of the day, that is the last thing Christmas is about.
So - ther eyou have it. In a nutshell. I am one who strongly beleives a zero-tolerance whilst on the diet is the correct and easiest and most effective and beneficial approach....and I will always stnad by that with no shame or apology.
Demonise food? Pah. I love food. And embrace food. But strive to do so correctly, wisely and for the right reason - not because there is a holiday printed on a calander.
So by all means - if a few bites of turkey - which will taste the same as they did a year ago, and will taste the same as they will a year from now - is worth risking it - then by all means, indulge and enjoy. But it is not what I would encourage anyone to do.
We all have our approaches, and I wish every single person here success - and will continue to do what I feel is right - as will you.
We don;t all have to agree, but should be free to support as we feel is in the best interest of those we care about.
Sincerest apologies if my approach has upset anyone – it is just something I feel very strongly about, and have always been one to stand by my convictions.
Last edited:
YesIcan2011
Member
Hi Blonde Logic,
I have to say I agree with every word you have said. I thought what you have said its 100% and perfect.
I really enjoy reading your posts.
Have a great day,
Lee
I have to say I agree with every word you have said. I thought what you have said its 100% and perfect.
I really enjoy reading your posts.
Have a great day,
Lee
MrsBurgundy
Silver Member
Funny you should post that BL -that's exactly what our LLC said last week when someone mentioned the same thing!!! (Especially the part about being a junkie or alcoholic)
I do agree with everything you have said, and i get where you're coming from, but as someone that has lapsed before (in 2009) and got back on the wagon with no problem, i can also see where Pandora is coming from!!!
I think it's all down to the individual, their state of mind, the support network around them and the amount of commitment and determination they have!!!
Granted, it may not be a sensible choice....and i don't think i would ever "recommend" deviating from a plan that works (and is expensive), but on the other hand - if someone wants to eat - i'm still going to support them, and hope to see them a week later!!!!
I think it all comes down to willpower, commitment and determination!!
I do agree with everything you have said, and i get where you're coming from, but as someone that has lapsed before (in 2009) and got back on the wagon with no problem, i can also see where Pandora is coming from!!!
I think it's all down to the individual, their state of mind, the support network around them and the amount of commitment and determination they have!!!
Granted, it may not be a sensible choice....and i don't think i would ever "recommend" deviating from a plan that works (and is expensive), but on the other hand - if someone wants to eat - i'm still going to support them, and hope to see them a week later!!!!
I think it all comes down to willpower, commitment and determination!!
slendablenda
Gold Member
As you know I TOTALLY agree with you BL - just didn't have the energy to put it so eloquently.
Thanks xx
:bighug:
Thanks xx
:bighug:
roundrachel
Silver Member
I completely agree with BL. HOWEVER...we're all different and deal with things differently. When I did LL first time around I took my packs on holiday with me for 2 weeks in Egypt, intent on sticking to my packs. However, the 40 degree heat and lack of calories made me feel incredibly unwell, so much so that I wasn't going to enjoy my holiday unless I had a few morre calories to make me feel better. So I ate throughout the whole holiday. I made sensible choices, only every had one course and lost 7lbs in the two weeks I was away. As soon as I landed, the first thing I did was have a shake, and no food ever passed my lips again until I reached my goal. It can be done. But being on holiday is very different to Christmas when you're surrounded by food and there is a flow of offers of tasty treat for about a month. Work parties, meals out with friends, christmas eve/day, boxing day etc. It's all psychological as to how you approach it. If you tell yourself you're only going to have christmas dinner and nothing else for the whole of the festive period then it is possible. And it's possible to still lose weight too. But the temptation is HUGE to just have a few left overs on boxing day. And then join in on new years eve, along with the odd glass of wine here and there. If you stick to packs throughout, there's just no battle to be had. You stick to your diet and never have the battle to get back on it. It's not impossible not to eat just a couple of bits of turkey. Plenty of people on LL have done it. But the number of people who have done it and then disappeared without a trace is much greater.
The easy option is actually not to eat. Not to have to face a battle to geet back onto packs however well you plan things. But we're all different and all have different relationships with food so while it is possible. I wouldn't recommend it!
The easy option is actually not to eat. Not to have to face a battle to geet back onto packs however well you plan things. But we're all different and all have different relationships with food so while it is possible. I wouldn't recommend it!
Spanglymum
Gold Member
I wonder about magda too. I hope she's doing ok. She was a huge support to me last year when I started out on LLT.
Don't want to get too involved in this debate, given that I've already shared my four penn'orth, but will say that I found one of the most useful things I learned on LL was just how often I did make occasions all about the food (or drink) and hadn't realised until I experienced them - and enjoyed myself (shocker!) without over consuming. It was quite a revelation to me.
Am still finding I have triggers to overeat - my recent holiday was one - but I'm so glad I gave myself the long break from food last year to at least start to think about my underlying relationship with food/drink as I saw it very differently - and still do. I know that if I'd chosen to lapse while doing Total I would have found it very difficult to get back in the zone again, so I found it easier to just say no. Not saying that choice is for everyone, but in the end I actually found it more straightforward to make one decision - no food til I reached goal - than make a goal, plan to lapse, debate when to start 100% again, think oh well I've not gained that much so I can get away with it, do it again, gain more... Think oh sod it I've blown it so I may as well have XyZ... Etc etc
Don't want to get too involved in this debate, given that I've already shared my four penn'orth, but will say that I found one of the most useful things I learned on LL was just how often I did make occasions all about the food (or drink) and hadn't realised until I experienced them - and enjoyed myself (shocker!) without over consuming. It was quite a revelation to me.
Am still finding I have triggers to overeat - my recent holiday was one - but I'm so glad I gave myself the long break from food last year to at least start to think about my underlying relationship with food/drink as I saw it very differently - and still do. I know that if I'd chosen to lapse while doing Total I would have found it very difficult to get back in the zone again, so I found it easier to just say no. Not saying that choice is for everyone, but in the end I actually found it more straightforward to make one decision - no food til I reached goal - than make a goal, plan to lapse, debate when to start 100% again, think oh well I've not gained that much so I can get away with it, do it again, gain more... Think oh sod it I've blown it so I may as well have XyZ... Etc etc
pandorasinbox
Queen Geek
I wasn't saying we should encourage people to lapse, maybe just don't be quite so abrupt about how we approach advising people not to.
I'm not entirely at ease with that addiction metaphor and that "you wouldn't give a heroin addict a needle for Christmas" thing kind of got under my skin (I know this metaphor is a LL favourite, but it seriously squicks me!) You say you're not demonising food, but in that metaphor the addict is clean and happy until they're confronted with the drug - their demon - and you're saying for some on LL that food is equivalent to a drug. A demon. Ergo, the use of the word demonising.
The logic of that metaphor staggers me a wee bit too. When an alcoholic or addict gets clean they can never have their vice again. Not so for food. By that metaphor's logic someone should have to stay on LL their whole life to get over their addiction, because if they eat anything they're clearly just going to get fat again (I know this isn't what you're actually saying, I just HATE this metaphor.)
As far as "only eating because there's a holiday in the calendar" - I don't think that's necessarily wrong. Social eating is a part of human nature - social eating TO EXCESS isn't. That's the problem. Having a slice of turkey, some broccoli and a few roasties on Christmas day isn't going to make you fat. What will make you fat is eating excessively like some people tend to do at Christmas, with every day an excuse to pig out, gorge on chocs or drink to excess. Again, we don't need to encourage people, but if someone says they're seriously thinking about it I think it's only fair to present the two sides: yes, it is possible to lapse and get back on the wagon, but it's hard.
Vis-a-vis "zero tolerance" - that's what we do when we do this diet, right? Or we ought to. Personally I'd stand up and applaud anyone who managed to never lapse on this diet for months on end and then skipped Christmas day out too (and I will applaud you if you managed it, BL!), but personally I'm going to be behaving myself and then give myself one day of eating a meal with my family before getting back on-board (assuming I'm not at goal by then!)
Not trying to pick fights or anything here. In my experience of LL so far there's a large contingent of LL subscribers who follow the same thought patterns you do, BL, and for most people you're probably right. I just don't think that we all fit the same mould.
I'm not entirely at ease with that addiction metaphor and that "you wouldn't give a heroin addict a needle for Christmas" thing kind of got under my skin (I know this metaphor is a LL favourite, but it seriously squicks me!) You say you're not demonising food, but in that metaphor the addict is clean and happy until they're confronted with the drug - their demon - and you're saying for some on LL that food is equivalent to a drug. A demon. Ergo, the use of the word demonising.
The logic of that metaphor staggers me a wee bit too. When an alcoholic or addict gets clean they can never have their vice again. Not so for food. By that metaphor's logic someone should have to stay on LL their whole life to get over their addiction, because if they eat anything they're clearly just going to get fat again (I know this isn't what you're actually saying, I just HATE this metaphor.)
As far as "only eating because there's a holiday in the calendar" - I don't think that's necessarily wrong. Social eating is a part of human nature - social eating TO EXCESS isn't. That's the problem. Having a slice of turkey, some broccoli and a few roasties on Christmas day isn't going to make you fat. What will make you fat is eating excessively like some people tend to do at Christmas, with every day an excuse to pig out, gorge on chocs or drink to excess. Again, we don't need to encourage people, but if someone says they're seriously thinking about it I think it's only fair to present the two sides: yes, it is possible to lapse and get back on the wagon, but it's hard.
Vis-a-vis "zero tolerance" - that's what we do when we do this diet, right? Or we ought to. Personally I'd stand up and applaud anyone who managed to never lapse on this diet for months on end and then skipped Christmas day out too (and I will applaud you if you managed it, BL!), but personally I'm going to be behaving myself and then give myself one day of eating a meal with my family before getting back on-board (assuming I'm not at goal by then!)
Not trying to pick fights or anything here. In my experience of LL so far there's a large contingent of LL subscribers who follow the same thought patterns you do, BL, and for most people you're probably right. I just don't think that we all fit the same mould.
Blonde Logic
Yes. You can.
You bring up some really good points PBox - and I agree with alot of it.
If we look at this from a psychological point of view I am probably projecting my own fear! lol I know I tend to be pretty black and white with this - and maybe at somelevel I feel safer if others are too! lol who knows??
(Definately not picking a fight - just a good healthy debate.)
I have managed 100% (no lapsing for 10 months - and so far so good now) It was not east - but it was the way I knew would work for me. But you are right - it just wories me the chance some might lapse and then fall off. You come to feel very passionate about this diet when it has saved your life - which it did do for me in 2008.
Anyway, like you say, we all know whats best for us - and when I get on my soapbox and start waving my pom poms about - just ignore the crazy yank in the corner!!
If we look at this from a psychological point of view I am probably projecting my own fear! lol I know I tend to be pretty black and white with this - and maybe at somelevel I feel safer if others are too! lol who knows??
(Definately not picking a fight - just a good healthy debate.
)I have managed 100% (no lapsing for 10 months - and so far so good now) It was not east - but it was the way I knew would work for me. But you are right - it just wories me the chance some might lapse and then fall off. You come to feel very passionate about this diet when it has saved your life - which it did do for me in 2008.
Anyway, like you say, we all know whats best for us - and when I get on my soapbox and start waving my pom poms about - just ignore the crazy yank in the corner!!
pandorasinbox
Queen Geek
First of all, well done to you for sticking to it for so long and for avoiding the temptations along the way! It's quite an achievement! :clap:
Secondly, I think the thing about projecting your own fear may well be partially true. I think much of what you say is driven by your own experience and your desire to protect other people from falling by the wayside - it's altruism. I think it's hard not to let our emotions play into the advice we give though. For example, I'm probably supporting the notion of choice because, in my experience, denying myself entirely actually makes me resentful and could actually cause a full on lapse, whereas allowing myself a little of what I fancy would steel me.
You're fully entitled to your opinion as much as I am and kudos to you for supporting it so vehemently, but I don't think anyone who is thinking about having a break for their Christmas dinner is necessarily a victim of crooked thinking or has doomed their diet to failure. Back on the the addiction theory: if we even say some of us ARE truly addicted, the fact of the matter is we're going to have to come back to eating normal food eventually. Whether that's a slice of turkey at Christmas or a full meal when we hit goal, if you're going to have problems with those demons at Christmas then there's a good chance you're always going to have to face them in some way. The onus is really on each of us to decide whether or not we are ready to face them.
Get on your soapbox if you want to, my girl. Passion is what keeps us alive, after all!
Secondly, I think the thing about projecting your own fear may well be partially true. I think much of what you say is driven by your own experience and your desire to protect other people from falling by the wayside - it's altruism. I think it's hard not to let our emotions play into the advice we give though. For example, I'm probably supporting the notion of choice because, in my experience, denying myself entirely actually makes me resentful and could actually cause a full on lapse, whereas allowing myself a little of what I fancy would steel me.
You're fully entitled to your opinion as much as I am and kudos to you for supporting it so vehemently, but I don't think anyone who is thinking about having a break for their Christmas dinner is necessarily a victim of crooked thinking or has doomed their diet to failure. Back on the the addiction theory: if we even say some of us ARE truly addicted, the fact of the matter is we're going to have to come back to eating normal food eventually. Whether that's a slice of turkey at Christmas or a full meal when we hit goal, if you're going to have problems with those demons at Christmas then there's a good chance you're always going to have to face them in some way. The onus is really on each of us to decide whether or not we are ready to face them.
Get on your soapbox if you want to, my girl. Passion is what keeps us alive, after all!
SandraCaerdydd
Member
Christmas last year was the start of my slippery slope too, I have just rejoined and I am going to maintain abstinence this year as I wont be at my target by then, I will be close but not there
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