Barbs thoughts for the future ......

[Barb]

That is an excellent saying. I just know that I need to be organised. I suppose I am like that in the rest of my life so why not with food? I am not saying I am miss super efficiency but I like to know whats planned each day, which office task has priority, what time I am visiting Mum and Dad etc.. so that is deffo in my make up.

I am anxious to attack this next plan in a different way too. I have never, ever set a beginning and end to a plan and I think that may have an interesting effect. I am also going down a very planned route calorie wise, which will be new and finally I have never gone mid week to mid week before. So, I like a bit of novelty and this plan should have it.

I've got a dinner party tonight for 8 so need to get busy, but tomorrow I shall get out my cal books and start planning a few days menu's. I think on my lower cal days I may take advantage of some ready made soups etc.. to ensure accuracy and minimise kitchen time.

Catch up later.

 

[Russiandoll]

I'm really excited about your new regime Barb - it has an air of positivity about it and I'm looking forward to seeing how it goes. There are SO MANY tasty low cal meals that you'll probably be able to continue having lavish dinner parties and your guests won't even guess you're dieting!

Keep us posted

 

[Barb]

Thanks Debbie - I think perhaps we are both in a 'new term, new start' kind of phase!
I am going to start a new thread, set up a new ticker and signature to really give myself that fresh start feeling.
The way that foods are cal counted now should make it a lot easier too - it is amazing to find there is hardly anything that hasn't been done for you! Brilliant. I agree I should be able to diet almost without others being aware; as you know I am unwilling to give up my lively social life so finding a system that I can live with is vital. If I can't go out etc.. because the diet is too strict then I won't stick to it. I know that about myself so it's no good me trying to kid myself.

It's like the no diet diet - I love the idea of it but I can see all I will do is gradually gain weight and then get even more fed up. :cry:
I feel quite excited that I have a plan, I am obviously happier when I do. So look out for the new diary from next wednesday and expect to see me 2 stone lighter in time for Christmas!!!

 

[KD]

It's like the no diet diet - I love the idea of it but I can see all I will do is gradually gain weight and then get even more fed up. :cry:

Oooo Barb. It's a tricky one. I see people want to do the 'only eat when hungry' thingy and it's so hard to know what to say.

I think I did a million gazzilion steps before felt confident enough to springboard myself onto this way of eating. Even then there were ups and downs. But you never know, some people can just do it.

What concerns me is when people who have had a lifetime of weight problems think that it's just as easy as it sounds. Of course, it isn't. After all, since when did hunger come into the equation when it comes to food

So it sounds like your head isn't quite ready for it yet. Hope that doesn't sound patronizing!!!...you've just got to be in the right place to do a non-diet correctly, and there are so many things to consider whilst you're doing it:sigh:

Your new plan will be the way to go until then and you know I'm right behind you however many times it takes to find the right way for you. I travelled many paths before I find my answer:sigh:

 

[Barb]

Thanks Karion - I knew you would understand how I feel and no, you are never, ever patronizing. It's not your fault you know a lot!!!!

I think the truth is, to lose weight/keep weight off you have to be vigilant. I am not good at that unless I have a very definate set of rules to follow. I start well, full of promise and then I tail off.... because it is easy. If you make no rules then you don't break any do you?

As said before, if I could be happy as I am I would be. I am not. I am consious of feeling fat, unflexible, unfit and don't even get me started on clothes!
I am going to be the big 50 November 2008 and I think that is a great motivator to get healthier and slimmer. I am not aiming for a size 10, I would be delighted with a 16-18 quite honestly.

I think I just have to take on board that there are no magic solutions, no overnight miracles that will see me slim. Just a sensible sustainable diet, some effort and commitment and I will get there, in the end!

So, the 13 weeks diet of cal counting starts next Wednesday. I will be organised and ready to get going. Logically there is no reason, other than being greedy, not to get my goal of 2 stone off in that time.

Please Dear Karion, pop in as much a you can, I love your feedback and ideas.

Love

 

[KD]

Thanks Karion - I knew you would understand how I feel and no, you are never, ever patronizing. It's not your fault you know a lot!!!!

Yeah, right little know it all me

Truth is I know a lot about some things, and hopeless at others

If you make no rules then you don't break any do you?

Very true, and this is one of the reasons you have to do 'normal eating' with care. Cos is well scary!

As I've said in the past, unlike many people that follow intuitive eating plans, I happen to think that dieting does work and there is a place for it. I also believe that if you are sick and tired of being the weight you are, then IE is a tough way to go. It's just not quick enough.

Of course, it will keep you going longer, but I couldn't do it to lose weight. I needed something faster than the speed of light.

I reckon it's easier when you are at, or close to goal and the urgency isn't there.

I am going to be the big 50 November 2008 and I think that is a great motivator to get healthier and slimmer.

I got to goal for my 50th. Well, I didn't have that marker for my motivation, but managed it in time :clap:

Just a sensible sustainable diet, some effort and commitment and I will get there, in the end!

Exactly. I asked a dietician once what made the most successful dieters, and she said that it wasn't any particular diet, just those that stuck with it.

There is a time for swapping diets around to find one that suits, but then you get to a point when you know you just have to stay on one until the weight is gone. Sticking at it through the rough times, the plateaus, the times when the chatterbox tells you that 'it isn't the right one for you'. Just got to work through it. Even so, as I say, sometimes we have to chop and change to find that special one that we can actually stick to.

If you are going to calorie count, maybe you can do some 'prep' for normal eating at the same time. Some might say you can't do the two together, but you can.

Calorie counting is so flexible you can work in some principles. Not so much just eating when hungry. I reckon thats the last stage in the IE system that I followed. Just registering the foods you have. Making a note of how they taste, how it feels when you eat them. More importantly, why you are eating it.

Strictly speaking, we only need to eat when hungry, so if you are eating any other time, there is probably an underlying cause. And no...it's not because you like it You could wait if that was the sole reason.

So maybe...just acknowledge. Doesn't mean you have to do anything different. Just be aware. Don't change your plans. Eat what you were going to, at the time you intend to eat. Just try and work out what effect it's having and how much you are enjoying it (or not).

that's easy yes??

 

[Barb]

You know you are right about that sticking thing. In 2002 when I lost 4 stone I realised that whilst i had not been angelic throughout I had pretty much stuck to it for 8 months. I was surprised at myself, I remember writing in my diary ' I thought I was a quitter and now I know I can be a sticker'. in fact of those 4 stone only 2 have crept back, which I am very pleased about. At least the problem has not got bigger!!!!!

It is not the odd blip that makes a diet unsuccessful, it is a sucession of blips with little control in between.

I want to go the healthy route with this plan, I am not going to eat 2000 cals of biscuits and wine on a Saturday, just because I am 'allowed'. I hear what you are saying KD about the whole eating when hungry issue; I am inclined to eat at times to suit other people and in all honesty that is sometimes the only practical/sociable thing to do. However sometimes I eat just because i fancy something, not because i am hungry or in need of it. Just because I am bored or fanciful.

I like cal counting because it works. I can set the rules and I can stick to them. If I do that it will work. If I don't it won't. Thats it.

I would like to ditch some unhealthy habits and learn some healthy new ones, that would be a very positive outcome too.

I just have to keep reminding myself that this is my choice because I am not happy as I am. Thats it, no-one is forcing me to change but me. So if things go wrong the buck stops right here!

 

[KD]

I am inclined to eat at times to suit other people and in all honesty that is sometimes the only practical/sociable thing to do.

I totally agree. However, you'd be surprised at how many times we eat when we don't have to socially, but just because it's 'time to eat'. Eating by the clock and all that.

However sometimes I eat just because i fancy something, not because i am hungry or in need of it. Just because I am bored or fanciful.

I understand those reasons, but make a note of it. Fanciful...well, it can wait then can't it Bored? Again, make a note. Each time. "I am eating because I am bored not hungry". You really don't have to do anything other than that at first. Just noting it. Okay...sounds bizarre, but then there comes a stage when you think "hang on...this is really crazy". Don't rush yourself with this. I was crazy loads and loads of times before I could actually get to grips with dealing with it and your calorie control stuff will still be doing its magic.

The AD thing that I've mentioned can also be used, but just to stop the compulsiveness. Making the thought = action immediately. Just stop for a moment and give yourself time.

Only when you are ready though. It's when we rush ourselves through these bits that we think we are failing and give up.
Oh...it all sounds very new agey doesn't it. Very american Getting in tune with the mind and spirit and all that but when I really started doing it properly, I was amazed at how inventive my mind was for giving me excuses to eat.

When I tried 'non-dieting' before, I had one excuse for why I was eating before hungry. It was just "because I want to" , when I settled down to it analyzing it properly, I ended up with about 50

The eating when hungry is another ball game, but you have to really understand what's going on in your head before you can do it. IMO anyway.

I just have to keep reminding myself that this is my choice because I am not happy as I am. Thats it, no-one is forcing me to change but me.

Cool. It's when you think there is no choice that the going gets tougher. Good on ya Barb

 

[Barb]

Thanks Karion! All good stuff to get my head round. Some of it really struck a chord with me in that it is what I have been saying to DD1 who is currently heartbroken. She isn't sleeping very well or eating very well becuase she keeps thinking about him- now she has developed some repetitive habits about him it is getting tougher not easier. For instance she wakes up and the first thing she thinks is ' I would have had a text from him about now', that upsets her and she starts going over the whole break up again. So I have persuaded her to write a list of all the things about him that were not great and she must read aloud one thing from it everytime he pops into her head. It seems to be working, she has broken a habit, sadly replaced it with another, but you can't have everything can you?
I don't know if any of the above makes sense, but it kind if does to me. We are all creatures of habit, some habits are really ingrained others are new or developing, it is the realisation that they can be changed that is empowering. That is what I am trying to get over to DD1, she has the power to get over the complete twit, she just has to practice at it. Equally I have the power to lose weight, i just have to re-learn my way of eating and using food for comfort/boredom/reward/consolation etc....

I was beginning to see that I use food for lots of reasons other than hunger but without a definite plan to underpin the headwork I couldn't sustain the experiment. Hopefully with a proper plan and the headwork I will do a much better job!

 

[girlygirl]

HMMMMmmmmm, where have I been these last 4 days? Busy I guess, don't know where this week has gone really. Feeling fat and fat really. Not sure where to turn or what to do. I look at my comment exactly one month ago today and think where have i gone with this new positive life? Back to eating and drinking what I like basically. Is that a crime? YES!!

I suppose if I am learning anything is it that I NEED boundaries; I am like a child in a sweet shop without an adult around to keep me in check. I am not saying I have binged or gone totally mad but having no real 'plan' to work to just isn't working for me. I was going to stay off the scales and I can't even do that properly (grabs large stick and hits self over head).

I think it is time to face the fact that unless I can be happy fat, which I know I can't, then all the saying 'no more dieting' is just rubbish.
Thing is I am not even obsessed with being super slim, if I just lost 2 stone I would be back in the realms of not hating myself. Yes, I would still be chunky but not miserably so.

So what i have to do is devise myself some kind of plan that allows me to still enjoy social nights out, wine most evenings and the occasional take away. Easy then!

I am thinking of going midweek to midweek; I've never done that before and I think that starting Mondays following the excesses of the weekend kind of lines me for disappointment. I also think I could incoporate some elements of Juddd. I need approx 16800 cals a week to maintain my weight, so maybe something like;

Wednesday = 1000, Thursday = 1200, Friday = 1500, Saturday = 2000, Sunday = 1300, Monday = 1000, Tuesday = 1200. Total = 9200 this would give me a balance of 7600 which should mean a steady loss of approx 2.2lbs a week.

If I did that from the 19th of September to 19th of December = 13 weeks X 2.2lbs = 28.6lbs!!!

I think that is do-able and I need to do it to make me happy. I can still have a more relaxed weekend with higher cal days and can make up for it on other days.

I have to stop kidding myself that staying this weight is ok. It's not. I wish I was like Dawn French etc.. who genuinely appears not to care. But I do. I hate the shape I see in the mirror.

I think going into it with a time limit and a definate focus expectation wise is reasonable. I am not going to feel like the 'diet' is forever, having said that I may, along the way, discover a long term plan I can live and lose with.

Wish me luck please, I know I keep messing about but don't get fed up with me. I need support and my Minimins friends have never let me down yet.

Love

Oh, Barb.

May I please say two very old-fashioned words to you?

They are, PORTION CONTROL.

This sounds cheesy and dusty and long in the tooth but these words mean that, most days (not every day)you can eat the foods you love yet fear. You have HALF or better still, one-third of your usual portion of chinese. You have less wine than you would like. You just have less, in general, of the 'usual' serving others who do not gain weight easily, or who do not care, can eat at will.

This to my mind is the secret of long term maintenance and weight control. Some weeks/months you will lose nothing, others you will lose a few pounds without even trying. Just be sure to include lots of good, fresh foods on a daily basis, and keep an eye on the total calorie count. This will permit you to feast, in limited quantity, on the takeaway grub you crave.

Most days/weeks I totally avoid such temptation. Why? Because once I start on a curry, say, I find it hard to stop. However! If I serve a modest portion for myself, then PUT THE REST AWAY to enjoy later, I can tuck in without guilt.

It is guilt that is killing you. We need to eat fewer calories to lose weight. End of story! The speed at which we lose is way less important than finding a comfortable place with food, day in-day out. That's what I aim for.

I wish you love and luck! Don't despair. Keep trying.

ps

to be brutally frank, and to be therefore genuinely helpful, I think wine 'most days' is inadvisable. Booze lulls you and makes you want to eat.
n

xx

 

[Barb]

You are so right GG, I know that if I eat less I lose weight. Trouble is unless I set some really obvious boundaries I gradully slip back into old ways. Hence my 13 week higly organised plan. I agree about the wine too, it definately relaxes the resolve, which on my new plan will not be good.

I appreciate you taking so much trouble to encourage me; thats what I love about Minmins, someone is always there to help and guide each other, which is fab.

Thing is weight loss is a tricky subject for something that should be so totally straight forward! Yes eat less lose, eat more gain, thats it in a nutshell but as Karion often says, we eat for a lot more reasons than just hunger.

I am going to go with this cal counting for the next 13 weeks; but I really like your simplified plan of eating 1 third of what others eat and I may well go onto that in the New Year.

Meanwhile thankyou for the love and the luck, I am very glad of both!

Love

 

[Barb]

Well, as promised saw my GP this morning and TBH it wasn't great. I have been feeling extremely exhausted lately, not tired, more like I could fallover at any moment. My stamina is almost non exisitent and I have been quite worried about it. Anyway the blood test showed I do need to up my thyroxine but she does not think that is the real problem. She says my asthma is not under control and I am not getting sufficient oxygen, hence the exhaustion, so I have to go onto a heavy duty steroid inhaler and monitor my peak flow regularly. She also said I need to cut down my workload; family of 5 at home, 3 businesses to run and elderly parents to care for, no problem there then!
I mentioned my cal counting plan and she was less than enthusiastic about it. She said cutting down a bit would be sensible but no strict dieting as I am not really well enough for it and I need to get my health/breathing/thyroid sorted first.
Now I don't know what to do. I feel like I am destined to fail before I even start and yet I admit I feel exausted and beaten anyway.

Ideas please; I need someone sensible to do my thinking for me.

 

[Russiandoll]

'Cutting down a bit' / 'healthy eating' / 'structured calorie counting' .... they can all go hand in hand can't they?

What your doctor is advising is that you don't embark upon a strict calorie controlled diet but you can eat healthily, and the very process of cutting back a bit involves restricting calories doesn't it? Surely your doctor wouldn't have advocated cutting back if he/she didn't think it was ok for you to lose at least a little weight?

So you might have to lower your expected loss for a few weeks perhaps ... maybe aiming for 1lb a week instead of 2lb but you can still have structure and a positive goal.

Try to eat low GI (refined carbs just DRAIN energy - in my experience anyway) plus they keep you fuller for longer.
This doesn't need to be a stumbling block Barb - you can still start your journey to a happier place but you will be jogging there instead of sprinting

 

[KD]

Awww Barb :hug99: You have so much to think about at the moment.

There seems no doubt that you want to continue to diet. I do agree with RD. Healthy choices, cutting down. I think you need to have a plan.

Other people might be better off just forgetting about the weight problem with this much on their mind, but I don't reckon you would. I think (like most of us) you need the structure.

I really can't see any reason why you can't still calorie count if you are happy to do it.

Your plan works out at just over 1300 calories a day. That's not strict. That's just sensible

Maybe even averaging 1500 calories a day may be slightly better for you at this time?

Lots of cal counters do 1500 cals a day. The benefits are great. It's much easier to sustain, and though the weightloss might be slightly slower, you'll be able to do it for longer.

It will feel less like a diet, yet you'll still have a 'project'. So what about upping the calorie allowance for each day, especially the 1,000 one? Could you do that?

Do look after yourself Barb. Lots of healthy food to give you energy and keep your mood levels on an even keel.

 

[girlygirl]

Hey, Barb and others!

'Cutting down' - lol - another old fashioned but 100% accurate and reliable way of losing weight.

I think I might just make a 'bold' statement here. For some of us - and I say some - VLCD-ing can prove a longer term disaster. No other diet can compete for rate of weight loss. No other diet totally removes responsibility for food consumed. We eat/drink only shakes, bars or Tetras. We drink mostly water. That's it.

Then reality hits. Your body screams, EAT. You discover that ordinary food poses danger. You live in terror of slipping out of ketosis and thereby regaining not just weight but your artificially suppressed appetite. And it is all so seductive. It seems almost easy when you first try it. Later it becomes a treadmill, and another reason to hate yourself. Well it did, for me.

How is it that we can so readily accept a totally alien way of eating? That we can embrace a powdered or liquid or solid meal replacement for months on end? That takes determination. We often think we lack willpower. Just imagine how much force of will is needed to stick to a VLCD, ketosis or no ketosis.

JUDDDING struck me from the outset as another binge/fast trap. The low calories required on DDs meant very poor nutrition unless one fell back on the old VLCD solution. Eating low cal ice cream and salad is not good for you. Overeating on UD's just increased the chances of bingeing in general. I have binged/starved for most of my life. That's why the mere idea of JUDDDING gave me the shivers.

In the end we come back to real, honest to God food. The sort you can buy anywhere. We just need to watch how much we eat, and how often we indulge the craving for tasty rubbish. That to me is the secret of weight control! And we CAN all do it. We just need to learn how to.

I have no desire to alienate those who 'believe' in VLCDs and have experienced wonderful life-changing weight losses. But I can't help but question the longer term outcomes.

I don't want to live on powder and water. I loved the choc tetras but they are so expensive I just couldn't afford them, long term. VLCDs do work - that is beyond question. However they raise questions that may be uncomfortable to answer.

Short term - fine. Long term? Probably not. This is just my personal opinion.

 

[Barb]

Thanks RD, yes cutting down and eating healthily would be good, but KD is right, I do need a plan. GG is right to, it is all about sensible portion control. So where does that leave Barb? In a bit of a quandry TBH.
In 2002, when I lost 4 stones I kept a food diary. I didn't cal count all the time but I did do rough calculations every now and again. The very action of having to record every morsel really helped. Writing down 2 ginger biscuits seemed ok but 5 or 6 didn't, hence would only have 2. So I am thinking about doing that again - it worked, slowly but surely and I didn't feel too obsessive. It meant I would opt for the low cal version of everything, cut down my portions, not invade the naughty drawer etc.. but never felt too deprived. Interestingly I think on the days i did do a rough cal count it was around 1400ish!!
So, I think I will start my food diary tomorrow, not strict cal counting but aiming for lots of healthy fruit and veg. I can tell by the way I feel that I would be easily defeated by the 'effort' of cal counting. For instance I was thinking how much I love home made soup, could easily eat it every day, so I thought I could make a large vat of it and it would be a very healthy, filling low cal lunch or dinner. But then the thought of all that weighing and portion calculating just put me straight off. The fact remains though that it would be a good thing to have as it is pretty much fat free with about 5million veggies in it. So I will make it, and write it in my food diary in the happy knowledge that it is a sensible thing to eat.

Yesterday I felt very down, I think I had been in denial for a while about how poorly I have been feeling and seeing the doctor brought everything into sharp focus; you can lie to yourself but others soon put you straight! Today I feel better, I have come to terms with reality, OK I am not going to see the weight falling off at any great rate but TBH if I was 10lbs lighter by Christmas I would be chuffed. Even if it takes longer the end result is what matters, so I must stop pressurising myself, get my food diary up and running and see what can be done gently and sensibly.
Thanks for the support, I do seem to really need it at the moment.

Love

 

[DQ]

Sending you some :hug99: and some positive :vibes:

 

[Russiandoll]

Morning Barb
I might have made myself a bit vague ... I was agreeing with you and advocating a plan. You and I are too similar - I know I couldn't lose weight without a plan. That's why I thought the doc's advice 'cut down a little' was too wishy-washy.
My hubby and 'cut down a little' and lose weight - but not me.

When I was calorie counting recently, I didn't pedantically count every single calorie. I ate veg and salad without counting but I did count everything else. And I actually weighed stuff ... the thought of it seems hassle but once my scales were on the work-top and I just 'did it', it really wasn't that bad. I also had my portion of grapefruit before every meal (lost 11lb in my first week - could there be something in the grapefruit research?)

You will stroll beautifully through this journey Barb and revitalise both your health and your inner-self. Admire the view on the way - appreciate how wonderful YOU are and look for the positives ... that's what you told me and now I'm batting that advice back to you.

Sending big hugs your way xx

 

[Barb]

Thanks Debbie, I wish I was with you then I could give you a real hug. I feel we are so alike (still hanging on to that twin theory seperated at birth!) and thats why I understand and agree with all that you say. I got what you meant and I think you are spot on; I can't do totally wishy washy, I need boundaries. What do you think of the food diary idea? I think that will help me keep myself in check without being too overboard on the obsessive side. I think the idea of just weighing the higher cal stuff is a good one, it helps to get your head round what a portion should really be.

I will listen to the 'batted back ' bits, I made you do it so fair enough. I do appreciate you Debbie, you are a real friend.

Lots of love

 

[Russiandoll]

I think the food diary is a great one. Apart from being able to 'visualise' what's going on with your diet, you can see what worked one week and what didn't.

I'm sure if I knew I had to write down 'six biscuits in one go', I'd think twice before eating them! It looks so much worse recorded on paper in black and white ... just downing them with a cup of coffee and not recording it enables you to 'overlook' what is a major calorie load. You immediately become accountable for what you consume.

But I still think that counting only the high cal stuff is a good happy medium and might help stave off anxiety and obsessive calorie counting. Also, as you mentioned, it will give you a better idea on portion size ( a big shock to me when I began weighing things!)

Are you going to record your food diary on here?